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I'm Confused, Are We Waiting For An 8.x Update?

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The release is coming very soon. Rather then release a product before it is ready, we made a business decision to continue testing and bug fixes a little longer. I think everyone would agree that a stable product is much better then a product released too quickly.

 

"Stable" vs "un-stable" or "released too quickly" is not what's at issue here. That' sort of like saying "would you rather be rich and good looking, or be what you are today?" Sure, we'd all like to be rich and good looking, and who's to say we're not already. The point is no matter who or what we are now, we still have to try and make ourselves better every day - and in ways that are visible to ourselves and those we interact with. Sure, I would love to see a 100% crash-free version of Retrospect - and I'm sure others would as well - but I don't believe that's going to happen - there are just too many variables out there with all the different type of disk and tape drives, computer hardware and OS changes, etc. So rather than wait around for more than a year at a time for some mega-fix, I would LOVE to see Rovi/Roxio adopt a steady schedule of minor fixes and enhancements. Each one should address a few of the most pressing problems that people are having, and they should be no more than a few months apart. This will let your customers know that you have not abandoned them or the product (which is what it feels like right now). I bet there are people out there who will agree with me, and if so I hope they chime in to this thread. Nobody really expects perfection - just a steady stream of improvements.

Thanks

Brad.

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The release is coming very soon. Rather then release a product before it is ready, we made a business decision to continue testing and bug fixes a little longer. I think everyone would agree that a stable product is much better then a product released too quickly.

I'm giddy with anticipation. These past couple of years with Retro 8 have had their share of frustrations. Thanks for providing the update.

Any idea if the new version will require a rebuild of all the catalog files?

 

Cheers,

Lyle

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"Stable" vs "un-stable" or "released too quickly" is not what's at issue here. That' sort of like saying "would you rather be rich and good looking, or be what you are today?" Sure, we'd all like to be rich and good looking, and who's to say we're not already. The point is no matter who or what we are now, we still have to try and make ourselves better every day - and in ways that are visible to ourselves and those we interact with. Sure, I would love to see a 100% crash-free version of Retrospect - and I'm sure others would as well - but I don't believe that's going to happen - there are just too many variables out there with all the different type of disk and tape drives, computer hardware and OS changes, etc. So rather than wait around for more than a year at a time for some mega-fix, I would LOVE to see Rovi/Roxio adopt a steady schedule of minor fixes and enhancements. Each one should address a few of the most pressing problems that people are having, and they should be no more than a few months apart. This will let your customers know that you have not abandoned them or the product (which is what it feels like right now). I bet there are people out there who will agree with me, and if so I hope they chime in to this thread. Nobody really expects perfection - just a steady stream of improvements.

Thanks

Brad.

 

As Brad mentions, having a series of smaller, 'problems are known to be fixed' updates distributed more frequently would be greatly beneficial. Maybe this is something that can happen after the 8.3 update, providing we last that long.

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... Rather then release a product before it is ready, we made a business decision to continue testing and bug fixes a little longer. I think everyone would agree that a stable product is much better then a product released too quickly.

Sure would. What happened for 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2, then?

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The release is coming very soon. Rather then release a product before it is ready, we made a business decision to continue testing and bug fixes a little longer. I think everyone would agree that a stable product is much better then a product released too quickly.

Robin,

 

Understand the term "business decision." Hope you do understand the customer base's apparent opinion (certainly I'll just speak for myself from here on, not what I read on these pages)- frustration levels being high, results and expectations being low. I think (most of the longer term customers, too) get that the basic functionality still exists in Retro 8.2.x for the current (Lion) OS, it's from the held over previous OS X version functionality. Sorry, but that's not much credit to Retro. In my particular case, still running Retro 8.2.399 (it's running as we speak). Just don't depend on it to be a one-stop product anymore.

 

Maybe we should simply start our own issues list instead of depending on Rovi/Retrospect to publish one... Of course it's actually a NOT WORKING list so maybe you'll not appreciate it? I'll be happy to begin a list for anyone who wishes to view/add/comment, assuming it's allowed here. Is there room for dialog about the product, it's viability, and it's usefulness? Dunno.

 

Bottom Line. Because of the issues, I no longer depend on Retro as my sole (primary) backup plan. Unlike others (my needs are relatively small and tape-less) who may be waiting around for you guys to get it together, perhaps, I use other products for specific purposes. I won't list the products. The features and reasons follow. Rather than rely on Retro, here's what I do:

  • Bare metal backup, near term (less than 5 day). Why? Retro restores are way too slow and cumbersome.
  • Incremental, large, infrequently changing files (Apps, Virtual Machines). Scripted clone/copy to specific partitions daily/weekly/monthly. Why? Retro backups don't restore well and individual files/folders, where the locations are known are impossibly slow to find and cannot be directly accessed despite the original location being known.
  • Certain preferences and log files are not backed up. Why? We made a business decision that the OS cloud based technology storing certain files is (sadly) good enough for now based on our experiences with bad backups, failure to backup in Retro.

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That's funny (make that sadly humorous), Robin. Your sales staff is touting Retrospect 9.0 due in two weeks! :blink:

 

Not that I'm waiting around for it to happen...

 

Are you serious? Maybe this could be a good thing and a sign of progress (since "early July" has now given way to mid-September w/ no news), but my initial reaction is that this bugs me in 2 ways:

 

1. If the Roxio staff thinks it's a full version release, then it must have many "new features" and "enhancements", which means that we're back to a potentially unstable x.0 release.

 

2. If they think that those of us that have been beta testing by using 8.0, 8.1, and 8.2 for the last 2 years are going to shell out more money for what should be a massive bug-fix release, they're out of their gourds.

 

FT

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That's funny (make that sadly humorous), Robin. Your sales staff is touting Retrospect 9.0 due in two weeks! :blink:

In fairness, Robin made that post over six weeks ago...

 

Did the sales staff disclose any more information about it (e.g. what improvements it will contain)?

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I’ve used retrospect since the mid 90s. For the most part is has been fairly good software with some bugs. The same cannot be said for the 8.x releases. IF the bugs were squashed, I’d be willing to stay on the Retrospect ship for a long time to come, but 8.3 better be good. The release should be rolled out soon too. We have waited long enough. As fhturner says make it *work right* and I'll be its biggest champion. Unless that happens very soon I’ll be forced to jump ship. On another topic when will email notifications work correctly? This has been on big rant from a very frustrated sys admin. Mayoff please give us some feedback.

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If you call the sales number they just say "in a few weeks" and if pressed for a more definite date they'll tell you that they could give you something but it means little since it might just slip further and further back.

 

What I find particularly odd is that if there is a major new release due in just a few weeks, why is there zero detail or mention of it on their website? Normally if something so improved is in the works, software companies want to get the word out. Especially when their current product has so many serious flaws and the hope for a working product may keep customers from taking their money elsewhere.

Edited by AJ08

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If you call the sales number they just say "in a few weeks" and if pressed for a more definite date they'll tell you that they could give you something but it means little since it might just slip further and further back.

 

This is so disheartening. It's been something like 14 months w/ not even so much as a 0.0.1 update to the product. And unfortunately Roxio seems to think that a massive, massive release is necessary each time they do _anything_. Why in the hell can they not fix, say, network scanning in 8.2.1, lack of save/revert options in 8.2.2, and so on? Now we hear about v9, which is probably another giant swing at things resulting in a whole bunch of new problems that won't be addressed for another 14 months.

 

Anyway, just staggering that Roxio's information release approach seems to have been designed to *^$$ off the maximum # of people. "We'll design a huge release that will be a complete bear to ever finish, including such things that most of our customers probably care little about, including Lion- and 64-bit-optimization, give a far-off deadline that should be enough time, then miss it not by mere days or weeks, but by at least a quarter of a year, and provide as little information and status updates as possible along the way, while claiming that we don't want to release anything before it's ready...you know, ready like 8.0, 8.1, and 8.2 were. Oh, and when pressed, we'll simply stick our heads in the sand and communicate even less w/ our customer base that is and has been a gnat's &%$ away from jumping ship."

 

Yeah, that sounds great. Ugh.

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Unless an OS change requires I update Retrospect in the immediate future I think I've just frozen my current Retro installation at 8.2.0 (399). I know I've waited long enough to hear about changes, updates and release dates, we just purchased and installed the aforementioned Archiware PresStore product. I'll be using the current version of Retro until I can restore my archives to disk, as soon as the old archives are backed with the new software I'll shuttle the catalogs and configuration files to external media and uninstall it. Retro 8 had an enormous amount of potential, I hope the next revision is available soon for everyone on this forum.

 

 

 

System specifics:

 

  • Intel Xserve (10.6.7 Server, 2 x 2.66Ghz Quad, Apple Raid card, 3 x 750GB Raid 5, 12GB RAM)
  • Roxio Retrospect Single Server Unlimited 8.2.0 (399)
  • Advanced Tape Support enabled
  • Archiware PresSTORE XXL Software
  • Apple 4Ghz 4 Port FC Card (driver 2.02)
  • Qlogic 5600 Fibre Channel switch x 2
  • Promise e610f 32TB (Raid 5, dual 4GB FC controller)
  • Promise e610f 64TB (Raid 5, dual 4GB FC controller)
  • HP StorageWorks 4048 LTO4 dual drive w/4GB FC controller

 

 

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Seeing Retrospect from a different perspective now that we're working with another product. Some of the really powerful features already within Retrospect are sadly missing in a much more expensive product. I didn't realize how much I depended on the OS integration that Retrospect has to offer, I'm talking about the ability to target a folder for backup activity by color. This is such a powerful feature, have a user tag a folder with a particular color and Retrospect can apply a backup strategy to it. It can move a red folder offline then archive it a week later. A simple, elegant solution that puts the users in charge of archiving folders in an 'ad hoc' fashion. I may keep Retrospect around just for that feature alone.

 

C'mon Roxio, time for your contributions to Retrospect to be recognized!

 

 

 

 

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The release is coming very soon.

 

By "very soon"... do you still mean while Lion is the actual OS? Or are you waiting for 10.8?

 

I do have so many issues with retrospect that we are actively evaluating other solutions. We lost so many hours trying to make 8.2 run stable... last hope is a HUGE fix round in 8.3.

If that doesn't come soon (and that really means SOON), then we will abandon this ship and be quite actively communicating this.

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Since we seem unable to receive an update, any recommendations for backup software to use instead of Retrospect??

 

We've just installed Archiware PresSTORE XXL and it's a whole new beast. There have been a few challenges to adapt to the new terminology but I am very satisfied with it's performance. As I mentioned previously I am really missing some of the features I used for years in Retrospect, we will need to radically change our workflow to accommodate the new software. We have archival tapes going back to 2004 that I will need to restore with Retro and re-archive to make recoveries less of a hassle, so I'll be maintaining our current Retro installation until I can make the transition.

 

If 8.3 turns out to be a free upgrade I will probably install it for the promise of better stability, if Roxio decides it's a paid upgrade to 9 then it's unlikely I'll make the jump.

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We've just installed Archiware PresSTORE XXL and it's a whole new beast. There have been a few challenges to adapt to the new terminology but I am very satisfied with it's performance. As I mentioned previously I am really missing some of the features I used for years in Retrospect, we will need to radically change our workflow to accommodate the new software. We have archival tapes going back to 2004 that I will need to restore with Retro and re-archive to make recoveries less of a hassle, so I'll be maintaining our current Retro installation until I can make the transition.

 

If 8.3 turns out to be a free upgrade I will probably install it for the promise of better stability, if Roxio decides it's a paid upgrade to 9 then it's unlikely I'll make the jump.

 

Im in the same boat. After making the initial investment of 2 standalone server installs (25 users each) from EMC, I hope to someday re-install Retro. My experience with other software is stability, however not intuitive to setup as Retrospect (my opinion).

 

I have been using a combination of BRU which works, just took a while to understand their terminology and backup methodology. Example: in retro you just select incremental and viola you have incremental (I know i know, oversimplification) in BRU you have to first create a full backup job, then add an incremental child job. The full backup has to run first (at least thats my understanding).

 

I also use CCC with its new backup to netwrok drives.

 

I am strictly disk to disk on my apple servers, we use tivoli on our AIX to backup to tapes.

 

I too am hoping on an update, since there has not been many changes (for me) since I purchased 8.0. Still here silently (well not now) watching these forums hoping for some news. With silence (from roxio as example), people form opinions that may be un-founded. My unfounded opinion is that Roxio just dumped a bunch of dough into this, and if/when they come out with something new, they will charge, and probably target a new market, leaving us here to purchase new or go home. That, to me, from a business perspective, might make the most sense. That does not make it right...

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I'm a sys admin at a small school in Idaho. I’m so done with Retrospect.

 

We are in the process of migrating everything over to a BRUapp from Tolis group.

 

http://www.tolisgroup.com/products/hardware/bruapp/

 

Network backups are so much more stable although the new software is a bit unnecessarily complex. If you have any questions on the process of migrating from Retrospect please contact me. The day for Retrospect is long since past.

 

The Bru appliance is very expensive, but you get what you pay for. Anyway one failed restore from Retrospect was enough for me. Retrospect almost cost me my Job so good riddance.

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