philcebutv Posted April 5, 2009 Report Share Posted April 5, 2009 please share your experiences good and bad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joelande Posted April 5, 2009 Report Share Posted April 5, 2009 Its not ready. Read through the forum notes (you can search on my posts for examples) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maser Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 I'm using it in production to backup my OSX servers and my Windows clients (primarily because I needed the "open file backup" that's been missing from Retrospect 6 for so long...) It certainly could be faster and I have to keep an eye on it because the console crashes unexpectedly occasionally. I have a couple of outstanding issues I need resolved before I can move my macintosh clients to my production system. I'm backing up to external FW hard drive with "disk" media sets and I've figured out enough about what needs to be massaged as to how to keep it going at this point -- even if there weren't any immediate fixes coming up. Because of my setup, I don't have any of the problems that people have with tapes and/or SCSI cards, etc... I'm hopeful that the update EMC says comes out this week addresses the last few major issues I have so I can move my mac clients to production. However, even with all the issues I've reported the ability to groom *and* run multi-threaded backups/restores has made the weird issues acceptable (at least for me.) And, IMO, the "final" release probably should have been "beta 6". FWIW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty321 Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 Avoid at all costs. Do a search of all the forum postings I've posted over the last week. Retrospect 8 is not even CLOSE to being ready for production use. It has caused my clients nothing but nightmares and tons of grief over the last week. Look at all my posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florent Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 And, IMO, the "final" release probably should have been "beta 6". I think of the same thing, but for basic use, the current version is working "fine" for me. I'm using it to backup three servers and a lot of RAID5 in eSATA/FW800. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philcebutv Posted April 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 thanks for all your inputs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 I am using it on my iMac at home to do nightly scheduled backups of all my data to an External HD. It has been running as scheduled for 3 weeks now without a single hiccup or failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joelande Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 That doesn't mean it is ready for product on 28 servers when you can get fired if the backup system isn't working Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xvi Posted April 6, 2009 Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 And, IMO, the "final" release probably should have been "beta 6". I agree, it's not even suitable my home use. I sincerely hope next update will iron all major issues out. In the meantime, 6.1 will be used on production systems here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florent Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Your comments are very painful... If you hate Retrospect, please do not insist on the forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
svenlm Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 I can fully understand Joel's position. I tried to use Retrospect 8.0 but I am not able to backup my MacBook with it. It just crashes every time, while Retrospect 6.1 works flawlessly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philcebutv Posted April 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 When could we expect the final working release of the retro 8? I believe this would take years or less Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florent Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 I understand too, but it's not a reason to leave a message on all post for telling users that's Retrospect 8 have some bugs. ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joelande Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 (edited) Listen. This is backup software. Designed for a very critical business application. The very nature of its role requires it to be as close to 100% reliable in every aspect of its function as it can be. We are not talking about wish list features here. We are talking about day-to-day basic tasks that are, at this point in the release, nearly 90% faulty. They simply rushed the release. The product where it is now, should still be in beta, maybe an early release candidate, but not a release. And historically, I have been a very happy customer of Retrospect WorkGroup Server for Mac 6 product, recommending it to many of my peers. But after Dantz was purchased by EMC, the product languished. I came back to give version 8 a look. My experiences on a day-to-day basis, since its release has been extremely unreliable, frustrating, and unstable, in its very basic use. All you have to do is look at the sticky warning at the top of this forum about how it can accidently erase all of your tapes! The question posted in this forum was very specific - would you recommend this for production. There can only be one answer: No. Period. If you think otherwise, you don't get backup. What really scares me is that EMC thinks it is ready for deployment in a production environment: I am using it on my iMac at home to do nightly scheduled backups of all my data to an External HD. It has been running as scheduled for 3 weeks now without a single hiccup or failure. This message, coming from apparently an EMC employee, is the scariest thing about the product. This product is not ready for production use. If this is what EMC thinks is "production ready" for a multi-server environment, that is a scary thought. Now, that all being said; again, I was a loyal customer for just short of a decade. I truly hope that the product will one day be ready for production. I have nothing against Retrospect (expcet for letting version 6 whither, and calling this release "production ready". I truly hope and look forward to the day when it is (and it probably will be, one day; probably sooner than later). Edited April 7, 2009 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucius Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 I am backing Joel here. IMHO, this was the worst software release I have ever seen, in any level of product. It was not ready for prime time, and should have gone through at least two more Beta cycles. I am not disrespecting anyone in saying this. In fact, to paper this over, to pretend like it's a great product, would disrespect the developers who I am sure are feverishly working to fix the bugs. I'm a long-time Retrospect user. I hope to continue being so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricU Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 We'll have the first of several updates to EMC Retrospect 8.0 out in a day or two. This first update will improve performance and stability, and it addresses several bugs reported here in the forums. With regard to the current state of EMC Retrospect 8.0, all I can say is that there were significant pressures, both internal and external, to ship in Q1, to get it out in the market as soon as the basic functions and restore reliability were there. Now our focus is on improvement (performance, stability, usability, features), and the first wave arrives this week. Thats where things stand. Best regards, Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucius Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 A company rushing to release something before it's ready is a company trying to wish away the laws of physics. Every time I've seen QA time minimized by wishful thinking, I've seen a train wreck. Whatever the pressures were to release prematurely, someone now ought to make an accounting of the cost of the damage to Retrospect's and EMC's brand reputation, and the internal costs of the thrashing and running around that must be going on now to fix bugs "yesterday." With the benefit of hindsight, was the decision the right one? And is anyone surprised at what happened? I sympathize with your position. But the dividends paid by a quality release are numerous and diffuse, and last a long time. I'm surprised that in this day and age there are still some managers that haven't woken up and smelled the coffee. End of soapbox... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BHIAdmin Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Yes, I am using in production on a 20 client network that used to run Workgroup version 6 on a Mac mini to external RAIDs attached to it (good throughput BTW). I agree that this version should have been classified as a final candidate. However, I am very pleased with the work that this development team has done to bring the program out of the dark ages of multi-dialog madness that plagued the previous versions. The approach and implementation are outstanding, even if significant bugs exist now. They did not have to make a separate standalone admin program, but they did. This is what administrators who deal with many clients need: to see everything about the backup system at a glance, without logging into the actual server. Kudos for going the extra mile. I also very much like the multi-threaded environment support, though have not tested it fully. Hopefully, the bugs will be squashed quickly and stability and full functionality will return. Until such time, I find it a testament to the design team's GUI work that I am able to implement the current version without even a real user's manual and get good results. Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerwood Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 These kinds of problems just don't cut it for mission critical tools like these. In my testing, 8.0 basically doesn't work. I appreciate the work that the developers on the Retrospect team have put into this project, but have to hope they were dragging their feet while management sent the product out the door. Moving forward: EMC needs to put out a solid release of this product soon (more important that it be solid than soon, however) to have any chance of reversing the bad impression this release makes. Further, they should comp people who have actually purchased this thing with an extra year of updates or something to ameliorate the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhwalker Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 All you have to do is look at the sticky warning at the top of this forum about how it can accidently erase all of your tapes! I'm not going to join into a finger-pointing contest because I don't believe that is productive to help users solve their Retrospect problems. Those who have followed my posts over the years know that our office has special requirements that many (perhaps most) other users don't have, and I have occasionally gotten on my little soapbox about certain bugs with the product that have irritated me over the years (and that have never been corrected, at least not yet). That said, to me it speaks volumes about the concern that EMC has for the data of its Retrospect users that it would immediately step up to the plate and let users know about a possible data loss issue so that appropriate caution could be exercised. A more indifferent vendor might have remained silent until a fix was available (or might have decided that the issue occurred infrequently enough to never address it). That announcement took courage. Even though our particular tape library wouldn't have been affected by this bug, I feel better knowing that, if a similar bug were to be discovered that would cause us to lose our data, we would be notified. We should applaud such courage rather than attack the notice, lest such an action be rethought next time. Thanks, Eric and Robin. Oh, in case you other forum members haven't noticed, these forums have remained public for addressing all of these bugs and for resolving issues. Many other vendors wouldn't do that. As an example, Tolis Group (BRU backup software) shut down their public support forums about a year or so ago in response to complaints about issues with their software. Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerwood Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 (edited) Thanks, Eric and Robin. Amen to that! Oh, in case you other forum members haven't noticed, these forums have remained public for addressing all of these bugs and for resolving issues. Many other vendors wouldn't do that. Very true, and it reflects very well on the professionalism of the Retrospect crew. Edited April 8, 2009 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Thanks for the words of support everyone. Eric and I are deeply invested in Retrospect. It is more then just a job for the two of us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florent Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Very true, and it reflects very well on the professionalism of the Retrospect crew. Exactly my opinion, in my case Retrospect 8 backup every day : 2x Database server without problem 2x Files server without problem 1x Mails server without problem (but a little slow ;-) 9x Laptop without problem It's not perfect, it can be better but it's enough in my situation and it's coming to be better with the next release... I never used a professional software where the team was accessible on a public forum ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcdretro Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 (edited) I will start by saying that I have been using Retrospect since version 1.0. The new design of version 8 is wonderful and has great promise. However, I have to agree with the others who say R8 is not ready for release. I have been checking the Beta versions over the last month and when I upgraded to the "release" version, I was expecting it to be much improved over the beta versions. Sadly, I cannot tell that there is any difference. My test backups using the release version all seem to run correctly but they always end with "Backup Interrupted". The so-called Log shows no information whatsoever about any errors and only says the the program launched. "Browsing" is a joke on my 8-core Mac Pro. It can take a full minute to display the top level of the Retro Server disk. It seems to me that the "Restore Assistant" doesn't even work (I admit that this may very well be due to my now-general frustration fatigue with the program). I think I have wasted a lot of time trying to get this release version to work and I have absolutely no confidence in the program at all. I understand the business pressures to release product by the end of a certain quarter but with something so important as mission-critical backups, it seems short-sighted at best to release an incomplete (and apparently potentially dangerous) version. I appreciate the efforts of the programmers and you have my sympathy in this situation. I hope that it was management that pushed for premature release. For now, it is back to 6.1 **Leigh Edited April 8, 2009 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.