Crashing ASIP 6.3

[Guest]

I am running Retro 5 Server on a G4 867 with 1 gig RAM and Mac OS X 10.1.3 trying to backup ASIP G4 500 Server with 1 gig RAM and two 72 gig redundant RAID (SoftRaid) with Retro Client 5. To avoid a server crash, I have Retro auto-mount the Server as the Administrator of the server and backup from the mounted volume. While the backup is running, the volume is inaccessible but there are no crashes.

 

 

 

To do this (if I remember correctly), mount the Server and select it in the Retrospect Volumes pane (under the local desktop volumes) and choose under the Volumes menu Configure. You will be asked to enter the Administrator login password. That's it!

 

 

 

I have not confimed that it copies all permissions and have not yet tried a restore but there are no errors logged in Retro.

[carlile]

Another piece of information. It's not the lack of CarbonLib 1.5. I installed that on my ASIP server, and tried another backup. It crashed after about 90 MB.

 

 

 

I did notice something interesting, however. The file that was being copied when the crash occurred was AdobeFnt.lst. That's a strange enough name ot stick in my mind. I didn't write it down after other crahses, so I can't be sure, but I think that's the filename that has been copying during the other crashes as well.

 

 

 

I have several files with that name on my server, so I don't know wich one it is. If I get a chance later today, I'll try removing all copies of that file, and try again.

 

 

 

Don Carlile

[IJS]

I posted this to the retro-talk list earlier today. I thought I should post here as well.

 

 

 

We just received our Retrospect 5.0 Server upgrade and we are having some problems backing up our ASIP Servers.

 

The backup server is running Mac OS X 10.1.4 with all the recent updates. Retrospect has been updated to version 5.0.203, the client software has been updated to 5.0.201. It backs up to a 30 slot AIT2 tape library connected via SCSI LVD. The ASIP Servers are running Mac OS 9.1 with ASIP 6.3.3.

 

We upgraded from Retrospect version 4.3 and imported all the scripts and preferences into the new software. Our script runs at night and hits each of our five servers in turn doing the usual incremental backups. The boot volume of the client machine is backed up without incident and when it is halfway or so backing up the main data volume Retrospect starts generating error messages.

 

The log shows maybe several dozen errors like this: Can't read file “filename”, error 1 (unknown), path: “path to file”. Then the log has this line: Trouble reading files, error 519 (network communication failed). Retrospect closes the connection and finishes with an execution incomplete message. It moves to the next server, does the same and moves on. Unfortunately The servers also then crash and have to be rebooted in the morning. Weird thing is that KickOff is not catching this crash.

 

All of the machines are on a 100Mb Fast EtherNet switch and all are G4's with plenty of RAM and HD space. We have run Norton on the servers and have found nothing unusual or corrupt. The previous night on Mac OS 9.2.2 and Retrospect 4.3 we had no problems, now with version 5 on Mac OS X we can't seem to finish the backups.

 

Our laptop users that are backed up during the day with Backup Server do not have the same issue. Only the ASIP Servers.

 

 

 

One other thing, our mail server, also running ASIP 6.3.3 on Mac OS 9.1 does not have this problem. AFP is enabled on it but no shares are published. One other thing I noticed was that the paths listed in the log in many cases contained 'odd' characters or leading spaces in the folder or file names.

[Guest]

My biggest concern to date with Mac OS X is "Permissions". It seems that if you auto-mount the Server using the Administrator access password for the Server(detailed above) prior to backing it up, the permissions are set to allow proper backup of the Server.

[IrenaS]

> To avoid a server crash, I have Retro auto-mount the Server as the Administrator of the server and backup from the mounted volume...I have not confimed that it copies all permissions

 

 

 

Actually it does *not* copy permissions. Retrospect doesn't have access to permissions through filesharing in the same way as through the client software.

 

 

 

Regarding the type 1 error, Dantz is aware of this and we are investigating currently.

 

 

 

Irena Solomon

 

Dantz Tech Support

[carlile]

Removing that file didn't do it. It was just a coincidence.

 

Don

[Guest]

Has anyone tested ASIP against the new 205 version of Retrospect? I can't go about bringing the server down for an unproven upgrade(less I want 300+ people screeming at me), so I'd like to hear if this does indeed fix the lockups.

[carlile]

Nope. Still crashes.

[jalguire]

I have a client running ASIP on a G4 Tower running 9.2.2 experiencing the same hang up/crashing problem with Retrospect. I eagerly updated to the new 205 build, but alas the problem continues to persist. Hopefully another solution is forthcoming.

 

 

 

Regards

 

 

 

James

[jeffgman]

The .205 update does not fix the Appleshare crashes. It was said in the announcement that they are still working on that problem. They hope to have a resolution soon.

 

 

 

Jeff

[vfranklin]

As I stated in my earlier post, every time I try to backup my ASIP 6.3 server, the server crashes. To clarify the word crash, I mean the server closes any connections to logged in users, the server’s Finder stops responding, but the mouse still moves. After a "crash" I am forced to unplug the server and plug it back in to reset it.

 

 

 

With this all said, I decided to check my systems before pointing fingers at Dantz and Retrospect 5.0. Here is a run down of my server equipment and steps I have taken to troubleshoot:

 

 

 

Server Equipment:

 

 

 

-Apple G3 266 with 256MB RAM running Mac OS 9.2.2 and ASIP 6.3. (Retrospect Client 5.0.528)

 

-SCSI RAID (RAID 5) 252GIG hardware RAID - connected to ASIP Server

 

-DP G4 800 MHZ Gig Ram running Mac OS 10.1.4 and Retrospect Server 5.0.205 (this machine is soon to be a QuickTime Server, but used for my testing)

 

-Dell PowerEdge 2550 1Gig RAM and 100 Gig RAID running Windows 2000 Server SP2 - this machine backups up fine.

 

-Apple 7250 with G3 upgrade card /128MB RAM and 18Gig SCSI drive (Retrospect Client 5.0.528) - backs up fine.

 

 

 

 

 

I first suspected that possibly a corrupt PDS or user/groups file could cause Retrospect to have issues. To test, I exported my users and groups file out to XML and then I deleted original users & groups file. I also deleted the PDS file. I then brought the server online (with no users/groups or PDS) and proceeded to rebuild a fresh users & groups file and PDS. Once the server was up and running, I tried backing up, and the server once again "crashed". I would like to note that Retrospect Server was able to "see" my ASIP server and that Retrospect Server was able to count up all the files, folders and permissions in the beginning stages of the backup process. It seems as though it crashes when the actual copying of files begins.

 

 

 

I check the Retrospect log that reported: Trouble reading files, error 519 (Network Communication Failed).

 

 

 

In testing, I also suspected trouble with my RAID drives possibly causing the freezing. To test this, I file-copied my data to backup hard drives and proceeded to completely reformat the RAID. I formatted the RAID in HFS+ (approximately 252Gigs) and recopied my data to the fresh drives. I then brought my server back up (with a fresh U&G file and PDS) and Retrospect client (5.0.528) and the server still crashes exactly as I explained above.

 

 

 

After spending two weeks troubleshooting, I am sure the problem is Retrospect. It looks like I’ll be backing up my X machines manually until Dantz finishes their product – at least Retrospect 4.3 works on all my other machines. I hope someone at Dantz can use this information to help in troubleshooting and finally fix the ASIP problem – I guess we’ll have to wait and see.

 

 

[nuclearice]

I am having this occur with the configurations below. The ASIP server locks solid after backing up a shared partition. I have the OS partition, that gets backed up and doesn't freeze up the system.

 

 

 

Yes, the ASIP is being backed up as a client.

 

The hang occurs after it backs up a volume that is shared. I have a OS partition that backed up and it went fine, and then the first shared partition backed up and went to tape, and it seems that after it goes to tape, it locks the server up.

 

VERY reproducible. Every time.

 

 

 

Version of RetroSpect 5 Server, Updated to 5.0.205.

 

Version of RetroSPect 5 Client, 5.0.201.

 

RetroSpect Server application is running on OS X. Memory not an issue.

 

RetroSpect Client is on OS 9. I have changed nothing here. since it is a control panel.

 

 

 

Retrospect Server machine:

 

G4, 400Mhz, 384MB Ram.

 

OS X 10.1.4

 

Cybernetics CY-TL8-2015 Tape Library

 

Atto Express UL3S scsi card (Given up trying to get the Adaptec card working)

 

 

 

G4, 500Mhz, 256MB Memory

 

HFS+

 

Virtual memory off

 

Mac OS 9.0.4, ASIP 6.3.1

 

no devices connected.

 

 

 

Rick

 

 

[jeffgman]

Very strange. I have shut off my script which backs up my AppleshareIP server because it always crashed the server. I had begun just mounting the server volumes on my Retro machine and backing it up that way. But, I had forgot that I only setup the date to shut off the script until yesterday. It ran the script last night, and it completed a backup with no problems. Very strange indeed. I will let it go tonight and see what happens.

 

 

 

Jeff

[cgarch]

I've a similar setup and mount my volumes in the same fashion. However my server will crash not during the backup at night but later the next day. Got me to thinking that there was something wrong with my server machine but now it appears clear to me that it is RS as the machine doesn't crash when I've skipped a backup.

[IrenaS]

*UPDATE*

 

 

 

Some customers have reported problems when backing up AppleShare IP servers with both Retrospect 4.3 and 5.0.

 

 

 

There is one problem reported with Retrospect 5.0 running on an ASIP server, where Retrospect is definitely not the cause:

 

 

 

The ASIP server crashes when Retrospect 5.0 autolaunches or is launched from an alias.

 

 

 

We have identified this to be a problem between Mac OS 9 and the ASIP software that may occur when any Carbon-style application is launched from an alias. We have duplicated this behavior using other Carbon applications, and we have reported the issue to Apple.

 

 

 

Other reported problems currently under investigation include:

 

 

 

Retrospect 4.3 running on an ASIP server asserts failure or hangs during the backup's copy phase.

 

 

 

The ASIP server locks up when the first user logs in following a backup of the server with the Retrospect 4.3 client.

 

 

 

The ASIP server crashes at the beginning of a backup with the Retrospect 5.0 client.

 

 

 

Retrospect returns "error 1 (unknown)" for some files backed up from an ASIP server with the Retrospect 5.0 client.

 

 

 

Due to the complexity of the AppleShare IP software and the difficulty in reliably reproducing these behaviors in a controlled environment, Dantz has been unable to establish that Retrospect is the cause of these problems. As such, we have opened a developer support case with Apple to determine the root cause of these issues.

 

 

 

We consider this to be a matter of the highest priority, and we will provide additional information on these issues as soon as we have anything significant to report.

 

 

 

Thank you,

 

 

 

Dantz Technical Support

 

 

[IrenaS]

Hello,

 

 

 

Dantz has been investigating several problems that customers have reported when backing up an AppleShare IP server with Retrospect 5.0. Reported problems include:

 

 

 

1) The ASIP server crashes when Retrospect 5.0 autolaunches or is launched

 

from an alias.

 

 

 

2) The ASIP server crashes at the beginning of a backup with the Retrospect

 

5.0 client.

 

 

 

3) Retrospect returns "error 1 (unknown)" for some files backed up from an

 

ASIP server with the Retrospect 5.0 client.

 

 

 

Our investigation has revealed that these problems result from using Carbon APIs with AppleShare IP software. Problem #1 occurs when any Carbon application is launched from an alias, confirming our contention that it is not a Retrospect issue. Retrospect 5.0 uses HFS+ file system calls, as specified by Apple, which stimulate bugs in the AppleShare IP software,

 

resulting in Problems #2 and #3.

 

 

 

We have reported all of these problems to Apple, but Apple's development efforts are now focused on Mac OS X Server. Without a commitment by Apple to address these problems, we have no choice but to suggest that our customers consider replacing AppleShare IP with Mac OS X Server.

 

 

 

Sincerely,

 

 

 

Dantz Development

 

Technical Support

 

www.dantz.com