syounker Posted May 30, 2003 Report Share Posted May 30, 2003 Does the compatibility problem between Retrospect 5.x and ASIP still exist? I upgraded last May (2002), had all sorts of problems and had to go back to 4.x to get my backups done. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 31, 2003 Report Share Posted May 31, 2003 Our Appleshare compatibility info is at: http://www.dantz.com/index.php3?SCREEN=kbase&ACTION=KBASE&id=26688 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syounker Posted June 2, 2003 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2003 I've tried those solutions in the past without any luck. I have no plans to move my servers to OS X until later this year (at the earliest) but have several users with OS X. Is there any way to get Retrsopect 4.x to backup an OS X client? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted June 2, 2003 Report Share Posted June 2, 2003 Retrospect 4 can not back up OS X Clients. I do not know of any workarounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flem Posted June 13, 2003 Report Share Posted June 13, 2003 We're also having problems with this. We've been running 4.x under Mac OS 9 to backup up a number of clients, including an AppleShare IP 6.3.3 server - no problems. We upgraded to Retrospect 5.x and the second drive (attached via SCSI) on the ASIP server was causing a crash of the ASIP Server at the end of the scan pass. Retrospect reported a Network Communication Failed. We upgraded to Mac OS X with Retrospect 5.x - this time the backup sometimes got underway on the second partition, but then crashed at different points (the ASIP server crashed that is). We moved the external SCSI drive to the internal SCSI - same problem. The problem seems to be some sort of memory leak issue with either the Retrospect Client or the ASIP Server, but it wasn't an issue under Retrospect 4, so that suggests that maybe something isn't handling things as well as it was earlier. Any ideas? We're going nuts here and the server contains most of our critical admin data, so we can't afford to be not backing it up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcobbe Posted June 17, 2003 Report Share Posted June 17, 2003 I, too, am having a problem with Retrospect 5.x and ASIP 6.3.3. I have upgraded the ASIP server to version 6.3.3 running on OS 9.2.2. I have upgraded the client on the server to the latest version. Sherlock indexing is turned off. In short, I have done everything that Dantz has recommended. When I run a Recycle backup, Retrospect crashes the server every time. However, a Normal backup, scheduled for the following evening works fine. After a lengthy discussion with a tech support individual, I find that I have three options: Upgrade to OS X (not an option), downgrade to Retrospect 4.3, or use the wonderful workaround of restarting the server every week after the Retrospect crash. This totally messes up several databases with heavy server dependencies. Is there REALLY a fix to this? I was told by the tech support person that it is Apple's fault. My question to tech support is: Why does Retrospect 4.3 work just fine with ASIP 6.x, but Retrospect 5.x doesn't. I am told that it is because Apple no longer supports ASIP. If ASIP hasn't been upgraded for two (?) years, why does the Dantz "upgrade" not work? This (my) problem has dragged on for 6 months, without any real solution is sight. I am sure that there are a fair number of people in the same position, all of whom are becoming increasingly frustrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted June 17, 2003 Report Share Posted June 17, 2003 For many customers 4.3 does not work with AppleShare for the same reasons 5.0 doesn't work. 5.0 just uses more of the commands Appleshare has not been updated to understand. Our investigation has revealed that these problems result from using Carbon APIs with AppleShare IP software as well has advanced HFS+ filesystem commands. Apple has made it clear that they will not be fixing this problem with Appleshare or within Mac OS 9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flem Posted June 18, 2003 Report Share Posted June 18, 2003 Okay, after some serious stuffing around and trying different things, here's what I think I know: 1) AppleShare IP is not under development (all development is focusing on OS X Server), and the way Retrospect 5 hooks into it seems to definately cause problems. For the official line, check this: http://www.retrospect.com/index.php3?SCREEN=kbase&ACTION=KBASE&id=26688 2) If you read that, you notice that it refers to the Retrospect 5 CLIENT running on AppleShare IP boxes. This escaped me until about the 10th time I read through it. What I've now done is installed the 4.3 client on the AppleShare Server, instead of the Retrospect 5 client. This seems to be more stable - it's not great, but it's better. Retrospect 5 will happily back up a Retrospect 4 client, but apparently the way the client itself hooks into the HFS+ system is done differrently, and works better with the ASIP/Client 4 combination than the ASIP/Client 5 combination - I'm sure someone with actual technical knowledge of how the clients interact with the disks will confirm or deny this. This may or may not be a "solution" but it does seem to have made our setup a little more stable, with the ASIP server surviving the backups on most occasions - as opposed to the guaranteed crash we were getting with the 5.x client. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asgeir Posted June 19, 2003 Report Share Posted June 19, 2003 The way we backup our ASIP is by mounting all the volumes on the Retrospect server. This way we avoid having the client installed on the ASIP making it more unstable. I can't recall ever having a problem with this setup. I would prefer backing up with an installed client, just like the other machines on the network, but at least this solution doesn't crash the ASIP. - Asgeir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcobbe Posted June 19, 2003 Report Share Posted June 19, 2003 Now that you mention it, Retrospect started crashing the ASIP server when I moved it off the ASIP server to another box. Obviously, when it was on the same box, no client was involved. What still bothers me is that I hear that ASIP and HFS+ are at fault. As I remember, HFS+ has been part of the operating system since OS 7. And ASIP hasn't changed for over two years. It seems to me that it is not all Apple's fault here. We are not exactly shooting at a moving target. The technology is old and dead. Why can't it be better supported? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flem Posted June 19, 2003 Report Share Posted June 19, 2003 Quote: mcobbe said: Now that you mention it, Retrospect started crashing the ASIP server when I moved it off the ASIP server to another box. Obviously, when it was on the same box, no client was involved. Try using the 4.x client instead of the 5.x client - as Mayoff said: Quote: 5.0 just uses more of the commands Appleshare has not been updated to understand. Our investigation has revealed that these problems result from using Carbon APIs with AppleShare IP software as well has advanced HFS+ filesystem commands Rolling back to 4.x which uses less of the "advanced" commands may stabilise your setup to an extent. Quote: mcobbe said: What still bothers me is that I hear that ASIP and HFS+ are at fault. As I remember, HFS+ has been part of the operating system since OS 7. And ASIP hasn't changed for over two years. It seems to me that it is not all Apple's fault here. Bit of both really. The change in how the 5 client calls things from the HFS+ system seems to be a contributing factor. That said, Apple are the ones setting the standards which Dantz are implementing in terms of how HFS+ system calls should be made. The problem is that they aren't working with Dantz to iron out bugs which those calls are triggering in their software. They're also trying to push people to Mac OS X Server, hence the lack of support and development on the "dead" ASIP platform. Note that this is just what I'm picking up from various posts and tech support articles - I have no idea if the system calls have actuallychanged at a code level, that's just what people seem to be pointing the finger at... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted June 19, 2003 Report Share Posted June 19, 2003 The attached AppleScript should be helpful to some ASIP users. This is an unsupported work-around for backing up your ASIP server data. Be aware that permissions will not be backed up due to the ASIP server being shut down. This suite of scripts works with Dantz Retrospect to turn off ASIP file & web services before scripted backups of ASIP servers and turn the file & web services back on after the backup is complete. This script will not currently run under Mac OS 10, 10.1, or 10.2. This Applescript has been tested with Retrospect 5.0 and 4.3 only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flem Posted June 19, 2003 Report Share Posted June 19, 2003 Quote: Mayoff said: The attached AppleScript should be helpful to some ASIP users. This is an unsupported work-around for backing up your ASIP server data. Be aware that permissions will not be backed up due to the ASIP server being shut down. Which means that if the server dies, I only have to restore the 20 or 30 thousand files and directories and then re-set permissions by hand. It's not really much of a work around compared to just running the restore.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted June 20, 2003 Report Share Posted June 20, 2003 Keep in mind that with ASIP files do not have permissions just folders. Also, if you do a backup of the server via Filesharing (mounting on the desktop of the backup computer), you will not get ASIP permissions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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