mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 I'm at wits end with this. I'm doing a single-file backup to an Apple Time Capsule. Initially, I was able to get Retrospect to mount the volume automatically and start the backup, but now it asks me for the password every time. I've checked Configure > Backup Sets, and when I double-click the backup set name, I'm asked for the server password, I enter it, and the backup set option is set to save the password for any access. But if I unmount the server manually, relaunch Retrospect and double-click on the backup set name, I'm asked for the password again! How can I get out of this infernal cycle?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Does Apple even support the copying of non-time machine data to the Time Capsule? Did you follow these steps: http://kb.dantz.com/article.asp?article=1144&p=2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 It does, Robin. As I wrote, single-file backups were working just fine over AFP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 (edited) It just seems that Retrospect isn't storing the server password properly across relaunches: . This particular password must be stored in the backup set (Tools > Volumes seems to do manual mounts without a problem but Tools > Backup Sets does not). So how can I get the server password to be saved across restarts? Edited May 20, 2008 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 I tested this yesterday without any problem. You must mount the volume while logged in as ROOT as described in the document above, and you need to check the box to add the password to the keychain. Did you follow the KB article steps plus click "add to keychain"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 (edited) You tested this on a Time Capsule? I added a backup set for my wife without ever logging in as root from her machine. While logged into my root account, I set up the volume and created a backup set and saved it to the Time Machine volume. I wasn't asked to save the password in the keychain because I had already saved it on a previous attempt. While logged in as root, if I quit Retrospect, relaunch it, and go to Tools > Backup Sets and double-click on the newly-created backup set, I'm asked for the server password. Again, the Volume will mount just fine manually from Tools > Volumes (which suggests that the keychain is being used), but it's the backup set that requests the server password when I double-click on it from within Tools > Backup Sets -- but only if it is the first thing I do after launching Retrospect, because if I first mount a Volume manually from Tools > Volumes and then access the backup set from Tools > Backupsets, it works, presumably because the server information gets stored somewhere in memory. Edited May 20, 2008 by Guest more precise information Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 I did not test on Time Capsule. I tested with a Windows NAS box. Did you go to Configure>Volumes and configure the network volume for automatic login while logged in as Root? You must do this step. If the volume is already listed, I would forget it from Configure>Volumes. While logged in as root, remount it and configure it in Configure>Volumes. from the KB article: * Mount the NAS volume on your desktop while logged in as Root * In Retrospect go to Configure>Volumes and highlight the mounted volume * From the Volumes menu choose Configure (Command-J) * Provide Retrospect with the password to connect to the NAS volume Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 (edited) I've done all that. Please read what I've added to my previous post -- again, I'm not having problems with volumes, but rather with backup sets. Edited May 20, 2008 by Guest more info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Please read what I've added to my previous post -- again, I'm not having problems with volumes, but rather with backup sets. I know you are not having a problem with source volumes. BUT Retrospect must still authenticate to your mounted destination volumes. If you do not configure the volume under Configure>Volumes, even if it is a network destination, Retrospect will fail. In any case, I have not tested with Time Capsule so I can't comment on its compatibility. Hopefully I can test it in the next week or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 (edited) Everything I wrote above is about destination volumes, not source volumes. I have configured the volume under Configure> Volumes-- many times. Mounting the volume works manually there (and presumably automatically as well). Mounting the backup set manually does not work without manual password entry under Configure > Backup Sets unless I've first mounted the volume manually (w/o password entry, since it's properly stored for Volumes) under Configure>Volumes. Is that clearer? Again, it's the backup set that is putting up the server authentication dialog, not the destination volume. Edited May 20, 2008 by Guest I've tried to be even clearer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 and the backup set option is set to save the password for any access. This option has NOTHING to do with network authentication or mounting of network volumes as destinations. This option exists ONLY for Backup Set Encryption passwords. This means that Retrospect will not ask you for the backup set encryption password when trying to open the catalog file or during a scripted backup. Details on this option can be found in http://kb.dantz.com/article.asp?article=1148&p=2 Do this: Unmount the network volume from the desktop Launch Retrospect Go to Configure>Volumes Click on the network drive you use as a destination. It should be displayed in the list. Click Browse. Retrospect should browse the volume, but you will NOT see it mounted on the desktop. This is a sign that authentication seems to be working correctly. When Retrospect runs an automatic backup, you should not have the volume pre-mounted. You should let Retrospect connect and authenticate to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 I understand the difference between encryption passwords and login passwords for volumes. If you read my earlier comments, you'll note that my wife's computer is able to back up to the Time Capsule without a problem, even though I never configured her backup set by connecting to the Time Capsule as root from her laptop (and there's no root user account on the Time Capsule, either). So when you write that the destination volume mounted by Retrospect shouldn't appear on my desktop, that doesn't really apply to Time Capsule. But you don't have a device to test. More importantly, you haven't really answered my question about why, if the Time Capsule volumes are unmounted, I am able to mount the destination volume from within Configure > Volumes but not the backup set residing on the same destination volume (single file backup) from within Configure > Backup Sets unless I've mounted the destination volume first from Configure > Volumes. My guess is that the key to the problem is there. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Do this: Unmount the network volume from the desktop Launch Retrospect Go to Configure>Volumes Click on the network drive you use as a destination. It should be displayed in the list. Click Browse. Retrospect should browse the volume, but you will NOT see it mounted on the desktop. This is a sign that authentication seems to be working correctly. Ι hate to write this, but I back up at work to an OS X server volume via AFP without problems, and I just followed these steps: I definitely see the volume on the desktop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Retrospect should browse the volume, but you will NOT see it mounted on the desktop No, you will see the icon for the share, but you may not see anything within the share. The OS X Finder is willing to display the _icon_ for a volume mounted by a different user, but it will not display the _contents_ of a volume mounted by a different user. The Finder has an effective user ID of something such as 501, while Retrospect runs as user 0. So a volume mounted by a process with a UID of 0 cannot be browsed by a process with a UID of anything else. But the volume itself is mounted at /Volumes/ I wish I had the time/resources/information to hunt down this behavior. I think it might be different today then it was when Retrospect 5.0 and 5.1 were shipped. For sure Retrospect could configure a shared volume in OS 9 using a password stored locally in Retrospect, since there _was_ no system wide Keychain back then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 No, you will see the icon for the share, but you may not see anything within the share. The OS X Finder is willing to display the _icon_ for a volume mounted by a different user, but it will not display the _contents_ of a volume mounted by a different user. Not true, Dave (though I think it's still true for Open/Save dialogs). I have a Retrospect backup ongoing to a remote server right now via AFP, and here are the contents: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Not true, Dave Actually, read more carefully what I wrote: "... you may not see anything within the share." It depends on the permissions; some permission matrices allow it, others will not.. My intention with that post was only to confirm that an icon for the remote share _will_ be displayed; I wasn't trying to dig into the various ways the OS deals with displaying data. Apologies if I wasn't clear about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Actually, read more carefully what I wrote: "... you may not see anything within the share." Perhaps you should write more consistently, since that sentence is followed by: The OS X Finder is willing to display the _icon_ for a volume mounted by a different user, but it will not display the _contents_ of a volume mounted by a different user. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 > Perhaps you should write more consistently... Sigh. I said I was sorry, and the ability to edit my post has already timed out. Perhaps some additional groveling would appease? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Actually, automated backups work fine. For some reason, Configure > Backup Sets always asks me for a server password when I double-click on the backup set name. And users of the Time Capsule should know that http://kb.dantz.com/article.asp?article=1144&p=2 does not apply to this AFP server. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Why do you say the article does not apply to Time Capsule? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Because as I wrote above, you don't have to bother with any of the root login stuff -- it's completely unnecessary and makes no difference whatsoever. Just save your single-file backup set on the Time Capsule as a regular user and configure as needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 because there's no root user on the Time Capsule The purpose of logging into the mac as "root" is not so you gain "root" access to Time Capsule or to use a root login into time capsule. Logging into the Mac as Root is used for ANY type of NAS: Mac, Windows, Unix based NAS, etc. Retrospect itself runs as root. When you log into the NAS box, you do it as "joe user" while logged in as "user". The problem is, Retrospect can not switch between "joe user" and "root". By configuring the network login, while you are logged into the Mac as root, you are making it easier for Retrospect to authenticate to the NAS using YOUR non root credentials. :crazy: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 By configuring the network login, while you are logged into the Mac as root, you are making it easier for Retrospect to authenticate to the NAS using YOUR non root credentials. This makes little sense to me. In any case, I'm telling you (who have absolutely no experience with this device) that it makes no difference whatsoever on the Time Capsule and is thus completely unnecessary. In addition, logging into one's Mac as root is a HUGE security risk, fraught with risks, and should be avoided if at all possible. Finally, my initial question, regarding why I must type the server password when manually accessing the backup set via Configure > Backup Sets or when restoring files, remains unanswered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted May 21, 2008 Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 (edited) You are logging in as Root one time, to configure the automatic login. You can disable the root account once you are done. It is a minor security risk. It took me less then 2 minutes to configure when I tested it. why I must type the server password when manually accessing the backup set via Configure > Backup Sets or when restoring files, is still unanswered. . Either Time Capsule isn't following the normal rules or you are still missing a step along the way. I did some additional testing with a Windows share, and as long as I "add to keychain", I NEVER get a password prompt. Doesn't matter if I login as root or myself. Doesn't matter if I log out and login again. I never get a password request when opening the backup set, after adding the password to the keychain. If the scheduled backup is working, then that is probably the most important thing. Edited May 21, 2008 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbizer Posted May 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2008 Retrospect itself runs as root. This has got to change. I know of no other user-level program that runs as root -- not even other backup programs. It's OK to authenticate as administrator, but running as root is a security risk (what if Retrospect went awry? It could delete whatever it wanted!) and causes problems with other software such as input methods (SpellCatcher X, notably). Will this change in Retrospect X? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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