johnmckinley Posted January 30, 2003 Report Share Posted January 30, 2003 I can't get Retrospect Express 5.0 to back up my LCD iMac to CD-R discs in the internal drive. My machine is the model with the combo DVD reader CDRW drive, a Pioneer DCR-111, and is running OS Z1-9.2.2. Retrospect Express gets as far as starting to write out to the CD, the two little cogs spin and the Pause and Stop buttons still work, but no data is writen. Stopping the back up leaves the iMac closing the disc, and I have to force quit the software. Is there a way of getting this combination to work? I've gone through the DANTZ compatibility list, and run Apple's Authoring Support Update 1.1.9 as well as running the Retrospect Express 5.0.238 installer, to no avail. I've been advised to try getting slower CDs, that is, ones whose maximum speed is about 16x rather than the 48x that all the stores here have. The argument seems to be that the discs are too fast for the drive with Retrospect Express, as the software uses block writing. This seems a little bizzare to me, and anyway I can't source slow CD-R discs. Also, the iMac will happily write to CD-R discs from the desktop using Disk Burner, although I appreciate that the disc writing method used is different here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmckinley Posted February 2, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2003 I just attempted this again with some slower CD-R discs, Sony 650MB 24x ones, with the same results:- backup appears to start writing to the disc, but doesn't progress beyond a couple of MB (as reported in the backup progress window), requesting that the backup is stopped produces a "cancelling backup" that doesn't finish, and force quitting Retrospect Express and restarting leaves me with a disc called "packet data 1". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmyJ Posted February 3, 2003 Report Share Posted February 3, 2003 Try booting with only OS 9.x base extensions, plus the following: -Retrospect SDAP Support extension version 1.2 -The Authoring Support Update Extensions: A) Apple CD/DVD Driver version 1.4.7 SDAP Authoring Support version 1.1.9 C) Apple Packet Media Access version 1.0.1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmckinley Posted February 4, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 > Try booting with only OS 9.x base extensions, plus the following: I'm not sure exactly what this means, but I turned off every extension and control panel that didn't appear to have been installed by either System 9.2.2, Retrospect Express 5.0, Authoring Support Update 1.1.9, or the Retrospect Express 5.0.238 updater. The behaviour persists. > -Retrospect SDAP Support extension version 1.2 > -The Authoring Support Update Extensions: > A) Apple CD/DVD Driver version 1.4.7 > SDAP Authoring Support version 1.1.9 > C) Apple Packet Media Access version 1.0.1 I have these extensions, although I have Apple CD/DVD Driver version 1.4.8 and Apple Packet Media Access doesn't show up in Extensions Manager despite showing up in Apple System Profiler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martinhenze Posted February 14, 2003 Report Share Posted February 14, 2003 I'm running an identical configuration (iMac 15" flatpanel, OS9.2.2, RE 5.238) and having exactly the same troubles as John. I now have a dozen coasters named "Packet Data 1". I've tried several brands of CD-Rs and CD-RWs, all with the same results. Like John, I've installed every update and progressively slimmed the extensons down to the bare minumum (further, even). I even tried letting the MacOS prepare the CD first and attempted a File backup to it, but RE wouldn't let me write to that, either. I finally punted and resorted to a straight Finder copy to a Disk Burner volume. I've used (and loved) Retrospect since I ran v1 on an Mac SE 30 back in the mid-80s. I've used it to back up literally thousands of gigs from dozens of Macs, PCs and even *nix servers. This is the first time I've been completely stimied! HELP!!!! (I've been on hold waiting for technical support for over 90 minutes, now. Looks like Dantz would do well to hire a few more support folks .........................................) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmyJ Posted February 18, 2003 Report Share Posted February 18, 2003 What brand of media are you using? Make sure you are using name brand media, such as TDK, Sony or Verbatim. Download the latest Retrospect Driver Update, available from: http://www.dantz.com/support/updates.html Try CD-R and CD-RW media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmckinley Posted February 19, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2003 I had previously downloaded the 5.0.238 update. This morning I downloaded the new driver update. This hasn't changed teh beahviour I'm getting. I've tried several Sony CDR65-24x, a Verbatim CDR65-24x, several Philips CDR80-48x, several TDK CDR80-48x, and a Sony CDRW65-10x. All behaved the same. If speed is relevant, only the CDRW is slower than the drive, whihc is rated at 12x according Apple's technical information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martinhenze Posted February 20, 2003 Report Share Posted February 20, 2003 Amy, I have downloaded the latest drivers (3.4.103). I have tried using several brands of CD-Rs: Fujifilm 700/80 (no speed marked; I routinely burn them at 32X on an EZQUEST Boa), Verbatim 1-16X, Verbatim 1-24X (the ones that come with new Macs), Princo 2-48X, Taiyo Yuden Silver 16X, and Princo 24X CD-RWs. Absolutely no difference -- Retrospect goes comatose with all of them; Disk Burner has no problem with any of them. Quite honestly, I think we're barking up the wrong tree here. Tell me, has anyone at Dantz (or anywhere else) ever successfully backed up an FP iMac with a Combo drive to CD-Rs using RE 5?? If so, what brand did they use? This is probably the most popular Mac; Retrospect is the most popular backup software for the Mac; CD-Rs are a very popular backup medium. The only thing 'unusual' here is that both Mike and I are running MacOS 9.2 -- a system Dantz developers are probably more familiar with than OSX. Have you run this by them yet? Maybe they need to take another crack at the Pioneer RCD-111 (which, although on the supported hardware list, wasn't mentioned in either of the two driver updates you had us download). Seems to me it's time to stop grasping at straws and burning coasters. Please, kick this one back to the engineers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmckinley Posted February 21, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2003 For me, RE 5 does exactly the same thing whem the FP iMac boots into OS X 10.2 instead of 9.2.2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmyJ Posted February 25, 2003 Report Share Posted February 25, 2003 It may be that your CD burner is having difficulty with standard packet writing commands. Other programs, such as Toast, use Track-at-once writing which utilizes the drive differently then packet writing. Retrospect reads and writes data using various device transports, such as USB, IEEE 1394 or FireWire, ATAPI, and SCSI. Each device transport has its own requirements and limitations, but Retrospect can properly and completely back up data using any of these. Retrospect simply sends commands and data to devices, following each transport's strict protocols. If unexpected errors are reported, Retrospect reports to the user. In a properly functioning system, all will be well. If, however, something is not operating properly errors can be reported. People from time to time contact Dantz because Retrospect does not work with a device, or that Retrospect reports an error, but that another application does not. There are many possible causes for this. First, and most frightening, it is possible that the other backup application is simply ignoring the error, and that your data is not actually being copied properly. Second, there are many ways to access devices, including hundreds of commands and series of commands an application can use to send data for backup. Another application many issue commands to a backup device in a different order, or in fact use entirely different ways of writing. This does not make Retrospect's access methods incorrect, or inappropriate (nor the other application's for that matter). Dantz spends tremendous resources on testing and qualifying various backup devices with Retrospect; if we certify that a device is compatible with Retrospect, we have thoroughly tested the drive. This does not mean that in some configurations other factors will not be able to interfere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martinhenze Posted February 26, 2003 Report Share Posted February 26, 2003 Amy, Amy, Amy, This is the same canned copout you've used several times before in other threads. I guess this means you're giving up on us (sorry John for calling you Mike earlier!). If what you're trying to say is that the Pioneer DCR-111 combo drives Apple puts in these flat panel iMacs really don't work with Retrospect, then Dantz should take it off the hardware list. No sense in John and myself (let alone all those who haven't tried it yet yet) banging our heads :banghead: against this wall any longer. I think there is a real problem here with how Retrospect handles this failure, whatever may be causing it. As John so well described, 1) there is no error message given, 2) retro doesn't really freeze -- it just waits forever, 3) it gets as far as marking the disk as 'Packet Media 1', thereby ruining it for any other use. I have also attempted to get it to work under OSX 10.2.3 with no success. With so many of these FP iMacs out there, I think it behooves Dantz to find a solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmckinley Posted February 26, 2003 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2003 I do appreciate that the possible combinations of hardware, peripherals, software and extensions is enormous, and Dantz can't be expected to put effort into every user's particular set-up. However, the combination we're having problems with here is the built-in drive on a fairly popular recent model which, at least in my case, is essentially as it came out of the box - I'd installed a new copy of Norton Utilities 6.0 (disabled during some of my compatibility testing), a new copy of Retrospect 5.0, and the updates above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmckinley Posted April 11, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2003 Interestingly, Retrospect Express 5.0 is quite happy to run a Duplicate script to a CDR in the internal drive, if the CDR has already been mounted and prepared by the iMac. Would I be correct to guess that Retrospect Express 5.0 uses a Finder copy operation for Duplicate instead of the block write used for Backup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmckinley Posted April 11, 2003 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2003 Sorry, I meant packet write. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmckinley Posted May 9, 2003 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2003 Having recently added an Iomega ZIP 650 USB external CD-RW writer, I'm content to find that Retrospect Express works with this external drive, so at least I can now back up my machine. However, I'd be happy if RE worked with the built-in combo drive on my flat panel iMac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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