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Thanks -- but as installing the virgin OS was the entire point of the restore in the first place, it looks like Retrospect is entirely useless to me.

 


I don't understand what you REALLY want to do. Tell me about the PROBLEM, not your proposed solution.

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"I am trying to reinitialize a drive on a USB-only G3 iMac from an image on an external USB disk."

 

The image was made with 6.1 -- I have a 6.0 boot CD.

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"I am trying to reinitialize a drive on a USB-only G3 iMac from an image on an external USB disk."

 

The image was made with 6.1 -- I have a 6.0 boot CD.

 


Yes, I read that and I gave you instructions which works for me. Why didn't they work for you? What error message did you get? At what stage?

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You advised me to install the OS. If I installed the OS, I wouldn't need to run Retrospect at all, since I was using Retrospect to install a virgin OS. The whole point was to save time (yet I have wasted about twice the time trying to use Retrospect on a machine with these particular limitations than I would have spent otherwise).

 

I ended up using a more modern machine with an up-to-date Retrospect to restore the backup image onto a thumb drive, then using Disk Utility from the Panther boot drive to "restore" the thumb drive onto the hard drive.

 

I still would like someone to explain how I can make a Retrospect boot drive with the updated Retrospect on it. If you can't or won't do it, please leave this open for someone else who might. Thanks.

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You advised me to install the OS. If I installed the OS, I wouldn't need to run Retrospect at all, since I was using Retrospect to install a virgin OS.

 


I wish you wrote that from the start. Usually you want to restore OS and all the user's files as well.

 

Well, I don't know of any software that can overcome the limitations of your hardware (lack of Firewire).

 

How to update your CD:

Launch Apple's Disk Utility.

Create a WRITEABLE disk image from the Retrospect boot CD. You may need to increase the size.

Mount the image (so it's visible in the Finder).

Install Retrospect 6.1 (and why not DiskWarrior or TechTools if you got it) on the disk image.

Burn the disk image to CD.

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Quote:

Quote:

You advised me to install the OS. If I installed the OS, I wouldn't need to run Retrospect at all, since I was using Retrospect to install a virgin OS.

 


I wish you wrote that from the start.

 


 

I said that in #100906.

 

Quote:

How to update your CD:

Launch Apple's Disk Utility.

Create a WRITEABLE disk image from the Retrospect boot CD. You may need to increase the size.

Mount the image (so it's visible in the Finder).

Install Retrospect 6.1 (and why not DiskWarrior or TechTools if you got it) on the disk image.

Burn the disk image to CD.

 


 

Would you mind much going back and re-reading #100904? I already described why I can't follow those instructions. I can find no "Retrospect" application on this CD to replace.

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I said that in #100906.

 


That was in your second post (not your first), using unfamiliar terms and not explicity saying you didn't want any user files. (Never heard the expression "virgin" in this context before.)

Never mind, let's get down to business.

Quote:

Would you mind much going back and re-reading #100904? I already described why I can't follow those instructions.
I can find no "Retrospect" application on this CD to replace.

 


Then you haven't looked in the invisible folders on the disc. If you know something is there on the disc, but you can't see it in Finder, you should look for invisible folders/files. You can do that in Terminal or by toggling a flag in Finder.

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Hah! I did look for invisibles in the Terminal. But I got suckered by the fact that the window that opens up when you mount the CD is not the top-level directory! As a result, I did all my searching subsidiary to that, and never noticed that it was not the top level of the disc. Yes, I found the applications in the Applications dir at the top level.

 

I've made the replacement disk now. Thank you for your help.

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The only thing I can do is boot from the Retrospect CD -- but it is 6.0, the backup image was made with 6.1, and so it won't do the restore.

 


 

Why not use the 6.1 CD instead?

http://kb.dantz.com/article.asp?article=8122&p=2

 

I'm not certain that simply adding Retrospect to a stock Apple installer image will work, as there might be temp file or cache locations that aren't available that way.

 

> What a joke -- I did this backup precisely so I could revirginize old machines quickly as they came

> in the door, and now I find that because my Retrospect boot CD wont read backups made with an

> update, and nobody can tell me how to update the CD, the exercise was entirely worthless.

 

Pardon me if I sound defensive, but who's the joke on?

 

If you're experimenting on the best technology to image an early gen iMac, it comes with the territory to think through what you're doing as you come up with best practices.

 

I used to use Retrospect with an external SCSI drive (loved those APS cases!) to image new 7200s; made the Windows98 team crazy that it took only a few minutes to get it done while they were struggling with Ghost images.

 

Today, Apple Software Restore, either from the command line or from Disk Utility, is generally a better way to image a fresh volume. It can do it at the block level, which can be much faster then the file level that Retrospect would do. See "man asr" in Terminal for (lots) more info.

 

Dave

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Why not use the 6.1 CD instead?

 


 

Ah, see -- that's worth the big bux right there. I searched for "cd update" on the support website when I started this project, but the only hits were about updates to RDU, so I didn't even know this was available. :-(

 

Quote:

I'm not certain that simply adding Retrospect to a stock Apple installer image will work, as there might be temp file or cache locations that aren't available that way.

 


 

Right, this seemed like too involved a project for what I wanted.

 

Quote:

Quote:

> What a joke -- I did this backup precisely so I could revirginize old machines quickly as they came

> in the door, and now I find that because my Retrospect boot CD wont read backups made with an

> update, and nobody can tell me how to update the CD, the exercise was entirely worthless.

 


 

Pardon me if I sound defensive, but who's the joke on?

 


 

That would be me.

 

Quote:

If you're experimenting on the best technology to image an early gen iMac, it comes with the territory to think through what you're doing as you come up with best practices.

 


 

Well, sure. But I don't remember seeing any warnings when I upgraded to 6.1 that the images it generated would be unreadable by 6.0. I come out of a corporate culture where such an incompatibility mandates changing the major release number. Now it's obvious that Dantz doesn't use that standard.

 

Quote:

Today, Apple Software Restore, either from the command line or from Disk Utility, is generally a better way to image a fresh volume. It can do it at the block level, which can be much faster then the file level that Retrospect would do. See "man asr" in Terminal for (lots) more info.

 


 

Thanks again. I didn't realize this technology was available free to the average shlub. I would indeed prefer a block-level utility. Of course, that would have left me even further up a creek with these non-FW machines, since Terminal isn't available from a CD boot, either.

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since Terminal isn't available from a CD boot, either.

 


Um, beg to differ. It is available on Mac OS X Server install DVD, and I described the procedure above (see post #98952 - 07/31/07 04:47 PM) to put anything you want on the standard Apple install CD/DVD (including Retrospect, Terminal, Solitaire, whatever you want). That's useful knowledge, especially if you have non-standard hardware that needs installers/drivers on an emergency disk (as we have). Been there, done that.

 

Look, macswre, we are all users just like you are. We are in the same boat as you are, just trying to help you out.

 

You seem technically proficient. You should be able to figure out, from my comments above, how to install Terminal on a non-server Mac OS install disk. If you can't, just ask. We are trying to help.

 

Russ

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You should be able to figure out, from my comments above, how to install Terminal on a non-server Mac OS install disk.

 


 

I'm sure I could manage it eventually, but it's just too much effort to spend just to configure machines that are destined for Goodwill in the first place. Thanks for the help.

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But I don't remember seeing any warnings when I upgraded to 6.1 that the images it generated would be unreadable by 6.0.

 


 

That would have been in the Read Me that was included in the 6.1 release where it states:

 

 

Tips and Late-Breaking Information

 

Retrospect 6.0 backup sets: Retrospect 6.1 supports backup sets created with Retrospect 6.0. However, once you write to a 6.0 backup set with Retrospect 6.1, you may get errors if you try to use Retrospect 6.0 to restore from this backup set. New backup sets created with Retrospect 6.1 cannot be used with Retrospect 6.0.

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Thanks. If the same document had only mentioned where I could get a 6.1 CD so that I could actually do anything about the problem besides "take it or leave it," my customer service experience would have been complete.

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I guess. I went to the Knowledge Base, selected "Macintosh" on the left, then selected "Retrospect 6 (Mac OS X)" below that, then entered "CD" into the search field.

 

The top result in the "FAQ Search Results" section was "Where can I download the Retrospect 6.1 bootable CD?"

 

Sounds like reasonable computerized customer service to me.

 

 

Dave

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I've already described how the search for a CD update failed for me. I suppose if you already know the proper search page to use out of how many are available, and the exact string to type, you can find anything you want. The fact is that your search facility was not so forthcoming for me.

 

I also think it's less than excellent customer service to put out one document that goes to all customers saying "we're going to break this," but not use the same channel to direct them to the available remedy.

 

Piling on the victim is one form of customer service, I suppose. Well, no matter -- Time Machine is being released tomorrow and it's looking more attractive by the minute.

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Oh, sure. Leopard will run just peachy on your "machines that are destined for Goodwill in the first place."

 

The "corporate culture" that you indicate that you come from seems to have made you eager to rant at those who are only trying to be nice and help you. I doubt that a corporation with that culture will last long.

 

Russ

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Quote:

The fact is that your search facility was not so forthcoming for me.

 


 

Gracious, it's not _my_ search facility! I'm just a Retrospect user, same as you. I just found, when I went online to try and help you, that the solution was actually pretty easy to find. For me.

 

> Time Machine is being released tomorrow and it's looking more attractive by the minute.

 

Perhaps. I wrote a note to Macintouch yesterday noting that Time Machine does not appear to have the ability to define any individual folder, or any group of folders, as the source of your backup(s). So if you want to have a Time Machine backup of, say, just ~/Library/Mail/ you can't do it. You can only copy all files, less Apple defined "System Files" and/or less specific user defined excluded folders.

 

With all its faults, Retrospect will still be able to provide a more flexible Snapshot based backup solution then Time Machine alone (which will be great for what it does).

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