Budgie Posted November 6, 2006 Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 I am using Retrospect 6.1.126 backing up to a Liace tape drive using Sony SDX1-35C tapes, I am not backing up over a network on Mac 10.4.6 I have created a script, supplied the script with appropriate sources, destinations, selecting all files, verification off, with a schedule, erased the tape that I am backing up to, and then run the script, all went well, I then did a restore of a few files which went well. If I add something to any one of my source folders the run the script it will scan through and verify, count files, permissions etc the error on the folder containing the changed folder/file saying "Catalog out of sync with backup set "1 Week 1" Select Tools>Repair>Update Existing from the Directory" I find this strange because the catalog is brand new?, but I do as i'm told, I goto tools and get things running, nothing happens, had this repair going for 12 hours, nothing was happening. Went back deleted everything made one simple script with one folder to backup, ran as above, all ok, goto run again and the same issue occurs "Catalog out of sync with backup set "1 Week 1" Select Tools>Repair>Update Existing from the Directory I have tried numerous ways of getting the back up to function with out getting this error, but have had no luck, was wondering if someone could advise me on some possible ways to remedy this issue please Cheers Budgie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhwalker Posted November 6, 2006 Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 You should not be seeing this. Perhaps was one of the test files you restored the catalog? Where is the catalog stored? What type of a backup did you do? Saying that you've got a "simple script" isn't providing enough info. When you "Went back deleted everything", what did you delete? Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 Hi Russ "Perhaps was one of the test files you restored the catalog?" No, it was a illustrator file. "Where is the catalog stored?" It is in the Retrospect application folder under Applications. "What type of a backup did you do? Saying that you've got a "simple script" isn't providing enough info." The script that I created was: Retrospect Directory-Automate-Scripts-Backup. "When you "Went back deleted everything", what did you delete?" I deleted the script, catalog, erased tape, then recreated a new script, catalog with a new name for tape, then performed a immediate run of the new script which did as requested. Budgie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhwalker Posted November 6, 2006 Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 Quote: "What type of a backup did you do? Saying that you've got a "simple script" isn't providing enough info." The script that I created was: Retrospect Directory-Automate-Scripts-Backup. I assume you mean "... Scripts > New > Backup", not "Scripts > Backup". Sorry I wasn't specific enough. What type of destination did you choose when you chose a Backup Set? Also, Retrospect has a quirk when you manually delete things - you also need to "Forget" the backup set. What I'm trying to figure out is whether Retrospect is using the correct catalog, and what type of backup you have. I'm just trying to make sure that the backups you are making are for the tape drive. How did Retrospect finish? Did it crash? Did it go through the "Updating Catalog" phase at the end? Do the logs look normal? Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted November 6, 2006 Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 You don't describe what flavor of Macintosh you're using ("Mac 10.4.6" is software; hardware descriptions are always a Good Thing Too), but if you have another physical hard drive connected to this box I'd suggest storing your catalog there and testing to see if this issue persists. I agree with Russ that this should not be happening; if there were something Very Bad going on with your boot drive, this might be revealing it. "Tweet tweet tweet, sang the canary in the coal mine. For a while..." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 "I assume you mean "... Scripts > New > Backup. Yes. After I have done "Scripts > New > Backup > "test" > a dialog comes up with Sources, Destinations, Selecting, Options and Schedule, for Sources I select my folders to be backed up, for Destinations I select New > Backup set > Tape > No password > Allow hardware data compression > "Backup Set A" > then I choose a folder to save the catalog into, which is the Retrospect folder under applications > save > with "Backup Set A" selected > ok > dialog appears "Destination Backup Set > ok > back to Sources, Destinations, Selecting, Options and Schedule, with destinations showing "Backup Set A" "How did Retrospect finish? Did it crash? Did it go through the "Updating Catalog" phase at the end? Do the logs look normal?" It didnt finish,crash or go through the "Updating Catalog" phase at the end it stopped at the below "Catalog out of sync with backup set" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 6, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 Hi Dave The mac is a OSX 10.4.6, 400mhz PPC G4 tower with 500mb ram (gotta get some more ram) I have one internal 74gb drive and one external 74gb Lacie firewire drive The hard drive has been working well apart from this syncing issue Budgie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhwalker Posted November 6, 2006 Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 Ok, you seem to be doing everything right. Let's try to figure out which piece of hardware has the problem. Instead of doing a tape backup set, try a "file" backup set (NOT a "disk" or "removable media" backup set), put the file on your external firewire drive. Define a subvolume as the source, perhaps the Documents folder in your home directory. Report results. Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted November 6, 2006 Report Share Posted November 6, 2006 Since it's a fairly old machine, I'd suggest some basic hardware/software troubleshooting. Boot from your OS X 10.4 install disk (or another hard drive with OS X 10.4 installed) and run Disk Utility to check/repair your boot drive. Make a new Backup Set and save it to your external FW drive, instead of inside /Applications/Retrospect/ Make sure your tape drive is clean - How is the AIT drive connected? Is it Firewire? Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 scripts > new > Backup > "FILE TEST" > ok > Source "MASKS on Macintosh HD" > ok > Destinations > new > File > no password > Name "Backup Set B" > Create Backup set file "Backup Set B" external firewire drive > Backup Selection, Destination backup Set selected > ok > Selecting "all files" > Options "verifaction off" > no schedule > save. ------------------------------- Immediate > Run > FILE TEST (Backup) > ok > execute > run > execution completed successfully > quit checked folder "TEST" on firewire drive two files exist. 1) Backup Set B 2) Backup Set B.cat ------------------------------- With no files added to source folder: re-launch retrospect > immediate > run > "FILE TEST (Backup) > execute > run > execution completed successfully > quit checked folder "TEST" on firewire drive two files exist, both showing modified times relevant to test. 1) Backup Set B 2) Backup Set B.cat ------------------------------- With 1 folder added to source folder: re-launch retrospect > immediate > run > "FILE TEST (Backup) > execute > run > execution completed successfully > quit checked folder "TEST" on firewire drive two files exist, both showing modified times relevant to test. 1) Backup Set B 2) Backup Set B.cat ------------------------------- With 1 folder and 239 mb of files in the folder added to source folder: re-launch retrospect > immediate > run > "FILE TEST (Backup) > execute > run > execution completed successfully > quit checked folder "TEST" on firewire drive two files exist, both showing modified times relevant to test. 1) Backup Set B 2) Backup Set B.cat ------------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 The OSX 10.4.6 is a clean install, done only 5 days ago, and alas im in New Zealand and the box im working on is in Australia which was set up then, had to fly home and check via Apple Remote Desktop, which then led to this ...... Have run disk utility from install disk & disk warrior also whilst in Aussie "Make sure your tape drive is clean" I cleaned the drive unit with a drive cleaning tape "How is the AIT drive connected? Is it Firewire?" The AIT is connected via scsi Budgie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhwalker Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 Ok, maybe we are making some progress. Quote: The AIT is connected via scsi What SCSI? LVD? HVD? SCSI-1? Is it via a SCSI card? What card, if so? Quote: 400mhz PPC G4 tower with 500mb ram (gotta get some more ram) I'm surprised that Mac OS 10.4.6 with Retrospect will run in that little memory. Again, try the file backup route and let's try to isolate where the hardware error is. Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 "What SCSI? LVD? HVD? SCSI-1? What card, if so?" Im unsure of this as I cant get to the box "Is it via a SCSI card?" yes "I'm surprised that Mac OS 10.4.6 with Retrospect will run in that little memory." me to, but it does "Again, try the file backup route and let's try to isolate where the hardware error is." The file back up is working well. The information I can get is from the System Profiler: PCI Cards: pci9004,7850: Type: Scsi Bus Controller Bus: PCI Slot: Slot C ----------------------------- Parallel SCSI: SCSI Parallel Domain 65536: Initiator Identifier: 7 SONY SDX-300C: Manufactuer: Sony Model: SDX-300C Revision: 0700 SCSI Target Identifier: 4 SCSI Logical Unit Identifier: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhwalker Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 Quote: "Again, try the file backup route and let's try to isolate where the hardware error is." The file back up is working well. Ok. This is real progress. Retrospect, your computer's internal drive, and the RAM seem to be working OK. It's only an issue with the SCSI-attached tape drive. Quote: "What SCSI? LVD? HVD? SCSI-1? What card, if so?" Im unsure of this as I cant get to the box Well, here's the support page for your drive from the information you have provided: Sony SDX-300C support page It also gives the firmware updates, etc., and Sony's diagnostic (Tape Tool). It might be instructive for you to run Sony's diagnostics for a bit. But see below on the futility of it all. The manual indicates that the SDX-300C is SCSI-1, single-ended. So you've got all of the possible SCSI-1 voodoo issues. We aren't talking LVD or HVD. Quote: "Is it via a SCSI card?" yes And now we have the answer. Because you provided the info from System Profiler, we know that you've got an Adaptec (PCI identifier 9004) SCSI card using the AIC-7850 chip. Adaptec abandoned the Macintosh platform as of Mac OS X 10.4. Their SCSI cards are not supported on Mac OS X 10.4.x because their drivers don't play well with 10.4.x. You need another SCSI card (or you need to revert to 10.3.9, which Adaptec does support). Sadly, pretty much the only SCSI card that works with 10.4.x is ATTO. Their cards are not cheap. We have an ATTO UL4D on our Xserve G5, and it works fine. Your older G4 probably doesn't need that high end a card, perhaps a UL3S or so. You might be able to pick one of those up rather cheaply. Seems a shame to be putting so much $$$ into an older slow machine with AIT. Good luck. Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 Russ Thanks for your time and knowledge, much appreciated, is their a points reward system in place in this forum? I was leaning towards the drive unit, but as youv'e clearly pointed out the PCI card seems to be the issue. I have a Mac in NZ running OSX 10.4.8 733mhz PPC G4 1gb ram, with a ATTO express PCI UL2D card, running the same set up as I was using in Aussie, my NZ set up runs perfectly, and has done so for a long long time. "Seems a shame to be putting so much $$$ into an older slow machine with AIT" I agree about pouring $$$ into a old machine, it's a fairly dead task, alas this is out of my hands. Is their a better set up than what I am using at the moment? meaning, is their a fire wire tape drive alternative, or maybe something else? etc, could you suggest some alternatives ? Cheers Budgie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 have just run the tape test, it appears to write and read ok? Last login: Fri Nov 3 15:46:28 on console Welcome to Darwin! AUS-SERVER:~ administrator$ cd /sony AUS-SERVER:/sony administrator$ ./sprobe *********** Sprobe ver. 1.0 for Mac OS X, Sony Electronics 2003 *********** dev0 appeared. *********** INQUIRY DATA *********** Peripheral Device Type = 1 Vendor Identification = SONY Product Identification = SDX-300C Product Revision Level = 0700 AUS-SERVER:/sony administrator$ ./sonytape dev0 -w datap.bin Sonytape ver. 1.8 for Mac OS X, Sony Electronics, Inc. 2005 Vendor Id = SONY Product Id = SDX-300C Revision Level = 0700 Checking tape drive write and read function. Warning!! This process will write over data and takes several minutes. Test Unit Ready Test Unit Ready Erase Short erase process is now complete. Mode Select Rewind Data compression disabled. 1,638 MBytes of data was written in 385 seconds. Write transfer rate = 4.25 MBytes/sec Rewind 1,638 MBytes of data was read in 386 seconds. Read transfer rate = 4.24 MBytes/sec Mode Select Test Unit Ready Rewind Data compression enabled. 1,638 MBytes of data was written in 198 seconds. Write transfer rate = 8.27 MBytes/sec Rewind 1,638 MBytes of data was read in 189 seconds. Read transfer rate = 8.67 MBytes/sec Log Sense Rewind Done. AUS-SERVER:/sony administrator$ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhwalker Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 Quote: Is their a better set up than what I am using at the moment? meaning, is their a fire wire tape drive alternative, or maybe something else? etc, could you suggest some alternatives ? Sorry, my only experience with Retrospect is on DAT with ASIP (thankfully, now retired) and Xserve G5, which is a bit different class of storage media than we have here. We use the Exabyte VXA-2 1x10 1u PacketLoader in our Xserve's rack. While our unit is SCSI attached to an ATTO UL4D, Exabyte does make a firewire version. They also have firewire versions of the drives alone. I would make the choice of what to use based on your amount of data, and it's unclear how much data is being backed up here. Exabyte does have a VXA-1 Firewire drive (66 GB compressed, 33 GB uncompressed) bundled with Retrospect (Exabyte part # 115.01108) which I see is selling for $988.14 (USD) at MacConnection. I expect other prices are similar. I would have a hard time recommending such an old technology (VXA-1) at this time. Exabyte has a VXA-2 Firewire drive (160 GB compressed, 80 GB uncompressed) bundled with Retrospect (Exabyte part # 115.02502) which I see is selling for $1,216.90 (USD) at MacConnection. I expect other prices are similar. Exabyte does not presently offer their current technology (VXA-320 and VXA-172) with Firewire. Exabyte's strength really is not in the drives, but in the autoloaders. They've got a firewire version (Exabyte part # 119.11500) of the VXA-2 drive and autoloader that we have, bundled with Retrospect, which I see is selling for $2,030.94 (USD) at MacConnection. I expect other prices are similar. They have an enclosure that you can use to put the autoloader/drive in for "tabletop" use (Exabyte part # 119.00525), but the drive/autoloader is so big (30 inches deep, rack width) that it would be better suited for use as its own coffee table. Too big for a desktop/tabletop; it's really only suited for a rack. Here's a link to Exabyte's web site: Exabyte We've had good experience with their drive/autoloader, and their support has been good. Some people (not us) have received DOA units, which were promptly replaced. With the declining price of drives these days, many people are using firewire drives for their backups. I've never done that, so I really can't offer suggestions there. Our backup policy is geared toward offsite storage of tapes, alternating backup sets, and the Exabyte autoloader makes that very painless. An autoloader will change your life. I suspect that other vendors offer better bottom-end solutions (DAT, etc.) that might be better suited to your situation. I'm just not familiar with those alternatives. Good luck. Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhwalker Posted November 7, 2006 Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 Quote: have just run the tape test, it appears to write and read ok? Yea, but that's not enough. The Adaptec drivers really don't work with Retrospect (or any other backup vendor's software) under 10.4.x. Here's the link to their notice: Adaptec tells Mac users to take a hike That's just the way it is. Sorry. Russ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budgie Posted November 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2006 Cheers for the info Russ, appreciate it Budgie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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