Creating a full backup

[bgolem]

I've read around here but still can't figure out the issue I'm having. We used backup exec for a while and it was very easy to use. We switched for reasons beyond my control. Basically, with backup exec you just selected what you wanted backed up and selected full backup.

 

I'm trying to back up only the C drive of a server. It's around 140 gigs. We have 4 of olixir's external hard drives in a custom bay setup. They just show up as 4 seperate hard drives rather than a raid.

 

Proactive backup is not what I want. I need full backups. That's a very bad idea to do incremental backups on a server. I created a backup set and set the destination to one of the external drives. I changed the backup type from normal to new backup set. That's what the tutorial said to do in order to create a full backup. The problem with doing that is it creates a new backup set and doesn't actually run. The message just pops onto the screen asking you to specify where you want the backup contents saved.

 

I went into the backup sets and saw it had the backup set i created "Backup set A" but it also had "Backup set [001] or something like that. I'm assuming thats the backup set it created but for some reason doesn't know where to store it.

 

This seems extremely complicated to use. All I want to do is be able to do a full backup of a single drive onto an external hard drive. I don't want an incremental backup. I want to be able to save 2-3 backups on one hard drive. They are 500 gig hard drives so space isn't the issue.

 

How do I fix this?

[Lennart_T]

I quote rhwalker.

Please provide:

(1) complete version number of Retrospect

(2) complete version number of Retrospect Driver Update

(3) complete version number of the OS

(4) complete description of hardware being used.

(5) complete description of the steps you are doing

(6) complete description of the problem

 

In the mean time, here are some general guidelines:

Create three "File backup set" on the 500GB drive. Let's name them A, B and C.

 

Then perform a "recycle media" backup to any one of the three when you like to.

 

Or you can schedule three scripts A,B and C performing a "recycle media" backup every three weeks, staggered one week between each.

[nekr0phage]

Lennart's advice is good, but with the Windows version of Retrospect you are better off using a Disk backup set. They are more tolerant of possible failures than file backup sets.

 

Also, you may want to look into the differences of traditional incremental backups and the 'progressive' backup of Retrospect before dismissing it completely. Many companies have progressive backups implemented with Retrospect and get great results in terms of backup time and ease of restore.

[bgolem]

It's too much trouble. It really shouldn't be this difficult to schedule backups. It's a poorly designed program but nice in theory. What's the point in creating backup set A? If you select new backup set, instead of a normal backup, it doesn't know where to save it. That's a pretty poor flaw.

 

Yeah, progressive backups are nice for saving time. That's because it's not backing up as much. It's extremely risky to do that. You are basically hanging your hat on those files being 100 percent correct.

 

I'm not sure how much more information I needed to provide.

 

We are running windows 2003 server, which has nothing to do with anything

 

We are running retrospect 7.5 with the most recent updates

 

I already said they were 4 external hard drives.

 

The problem is when I schedule a backup, it doesn't work. It will start to run, but then you get the "Check media" dialog box. The box wants you to select where you want it to save. It's completely insane for retrospect to create a new backup set everytime just to make a full backup. That means I'll have a new backup set for each day. That's pointless.

 

I don't want to do a recycle backup. I want to be able to keep 2-3 backups on the hard drive. The manual for retrospect said to do a new backup set in order to have a full backup. This is way too much work to back up a server. The program doesn't work right. You have to sit there and specify where you want the backup saved.

 

I'll just have to go back to veritas. That's what i get for buying software without trying it first. What a waste of money.

[Lennart_T]

It isn't that difficult. I suggest you RTFM and come back asking specific questions, like "I don't understand what it says on page..."

 

It isn't more risky with progressive backups than a full backup. In both cases you rely on all files being 100 percent correct.

 

I don't quite understand what you do wrong as Retrospect should just save your backup where you created the backup set. And do it without asking a second time. Can you provide a complete step-by-step description of what you do?

 

I think you should give Retrospect another chance. It's the best backup software I know of.

 

And by the way, EMC offers Retrospect as a 30 day free tryout.

[willflint]

Brian,

I am sorry I didn't see your post earlier than now, but what you are trying to do is EXTREMELY EASY!!! Retrospect actually has a wizard for it. When you go to Manage scripts you want to choose

1. Backup

 

1a. If you are in Wizard mode either click next or choose Let Me Change... then click next

1b. If you are not in Wizard Mode (Advanced Mode) then name the script; then to switch to Wizard Mode, you can click the link in the bottom left corner

 

2. On the WHAT DO YOU WANT TO BACKUP page, select Let me choose and click Next

 

3. Choose the server or servers you want then click next

 

4. Since you want full backups, make sure all items are checked on the WHAT TYPES OF FILES... screen, then click next

 

5. On the WHERE DO YOU WANT THE BACKUP TO BE STORED screen, choose one of your External drives, then click next

 

6. On the WHEN DO YOU WANT TO BACKUP screen, choose Later and click Next

 

7. On this screen you will want to choose which days and time you are performing your Full backups, in my environment, we do fulls 6 days a week (Su-F) at 9PM, click next

 

8. On the HOW MANY BACKUP SETS WOULD YOU LIKE TO USE screen, choose Multiple Backup Sets, click next

 

8a. Now I know you made the comment, "It's completely insane for retrospect to create a new backup set everytime just to make a full backup. That means I'll have a new backup set for each day. That's pointless." But what do you think tape backup solutions are doing??? That is the ONLY way to do a FULL Backup. You think putting all of your Full backups in one file or backupset is safe, then you must be new to enterprise disaster recovery!!! Yes, NTBackup allows you to amend Full Backups to one file, but good luck ever trying to restore any data from it! The best way to keep your data safe is to save it, then never turn the PC on again!!! (sorry, data security joke) But the next best thing is to back up to multiple back up sets. The great thing about retrospect is that no matter how many backup sets you choose, your data is always available for quick restore from disk! Anyway, back to the subject at hand.

 

9. On the next screen, choose Use six Backup Sets, one for each day (if you chose to do Fulls daily, then it should say seven, anyway, you get the point), click next

 

10. On the NAME YOUR BACKUP SETS screen, you can choose to name all new or use a mix of existing backup sets in this script. Just remember that for every duplicate use of a backup set by one server will cause that server to only perform an incremental backup (but I will get to the part that makes this automate full backups), so I suggest naming 6 all new backup sets, then click next

 

11. I suggest choosing YES to compression and Securing your backups on the following 2 screens. On the Security Screen, choose REMEBER PASSWORD FOR SCRIPTED ACCESS if you decide to use a password. This way you want be required to use a password every night to perform the backup, but it will require knowledge of the password to do restores or setting up new backups with the backup sets.

 

12. Since we are doing full backups we need to select ASK FOR NEW DISK. Click next.

 

13. Choose a name for the Script, click next

 

14. The BACKUP SUMMARY allows you to review a few points of the backup script, verify it and click Finish (DO NOT SELECT BACKUP NOW)

 

14a. OK, now you have to do a little front end leg work to prevent your agonizing issue with Retro asking for "where to store" backups

 

15. Ok, locate the first backup set created in your script (it is normally the one being used for Sunday's backup). Open the properties of the backup set then adjust the size of the Member for that backup set. Just keep in mind, you are doing Full compressed backups of each servers' data so you do want to skimp on the space but you don't want to over do it since later we are going to just recycle this backup anyway

 

16. Now, locate the next backup set created in your script (it doesn't matter this time). Open the properties of the backup set then Add a Member and make it the same size as the set in step 15 (this is the step you missed before and why Retro was asking you "where to store" you never told it ahead of time). So now that you have added that member, Retro will no longer ask "where to store", unless of course you run out of space in the member and need to expand it or add another member

 

16a. Repeat 16 for each additional backup set created in the script

 

17. OK, now we need to make some adjustments to the script so that it performs the way we want, Open the script and click Switch to Advanced Mode

 

18. Now, click the schedule button and Modify all of the scheduled backups from Normal to Recycle. This way we will have a new backup of each day (a Full) for each week. This will maintain up to 6 full backups per server on the external drives. Remember, a recycle (erasing) action is only done on the backup set when it is used. So you will still have the previous 6 days' data available for restores (we will also create some archiving later to maintain more days if you like)

 

18a. OK, now as it stands we have done just what you wanted, we have Full backups for each server, we have the added security that the backups are in separate (secured if you encrypted/pasword protected) backup sets

 

19. OPTIONAL: An additional step you can take is to increase the number of available backups on disc. To do this:

 

19a. Edit the script in Advanced Mode

19b. Add 6 more, new, backup sets to the destinations list (during this edit you can actually specify the member location while creating the backup set)

19c. Then on the Schedule change the current schedules to show Recycle backups every 2 weeks instead of 1 week

19d. Then add new schedules (Repeating Interval) to show Recycle backups every 2 weeks, but have it start the week following your currents:

19d1. It should look like this:

Recycle backup to SUNDAY A

Every other week on Sunday, starting 11/5/2006

Recycle backup to SUNDAY B

Every other week on Sunday, starting 11/12/2006

Recycle backup to MONDAY A

Every other week on Monday, starting 11/6/2006

Recycle backup to MONDAY B

Every other week on Monday, starting 11/13/2006

.... etc, etc

19e. This will now give you 12 Full Backups per server, and you can add more weeks as you like

 

20. OPTIONAL: Another option, that I use is to increase the amount of backups is to create an Archive of the server backups

20a. To do this, just setup a script to Transfer Backup Sets

20b. Your source will be ALL of the daily backupsets we created above

20c. Your destination will be a new backup set on either one of your external drives or another drive share on the network

20d. This should be scheduled daily at a time after the backups have compeleted (4AM in my environment)

20e. This will copy the backups peformed each night to the Archive, thus allowing you to further maintain more backups on disc for restores

 

21. OPTIONAL, but highly recommended: And finally, the best thing you can do is get these disc backups off your network and offsite. I recommend an automated Transfer Backup Set to Tape or an External Drive that you take to an offsite location each morning or evening. I prefer evening offsite runs since usually, most catastrophes will occur over night or when the business is closed.

 

Well, in a nutshell, that is how to perform nightly full backups with retrospect. I HIGHLY recommend you reconsider leaving Retro for Backup Exec, I have tried both and, don't fool yourself, Backup Exec has its flaws and is only now just getting into the D2D2T business. Believe me, I have compared SEVERAL solutions and Retro won my business hands down. Yes, it needs better reporting (for us report geeks) and yes they need to do something about the 5 million file per session issues, but other than that it is a solid product when you know how to use. And hey if you don't, you have guys like me here on the forum to tell you!!!

 

Hope that helps you and/or someone. And like I said, don't be daunted by the "multiple backup set" thing; take it from a guy who learned the hard way that a single backup set is like NEVER BACKING UP AT ALL!!! Take care and don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions.

[bgolem]

You explained it much better than lennart. I'll try what you suggested tomorrow. I definitely appreciate you taking the time. I have 10 million other things to worry about and didn't realize it would be this involved just to make a backup script.

 

Anyone who relies on progressive or incremental backups or any software that only backs up changed files is taking a huge risk. I hope some of these posters here are nothing more than retrospect users. If they actually worked for retrospect that would be pretty pathetic. You really don't see anything risky about keeping one copy of a backup? Are you serious? Businesses go under every day for the sole reason of a failed network.

 

Progressive backups might be nice for home computers or client machines. I don't need something that's going to back up quicker or restore quicker. I need something that is 110 percent reliable. We switched from Backup Exec because my boss had problems with one of their sales reps. Hopefully, what you described to do will work so I don't have to switch back. Off-site storage is what we just recently switched to. We heard of a company called Olixir Technologies. Their products got great reviews from PCMag. They basically made a durable hard drive that is made to be transported without the risk of losing data. It's made to replace tape drives. I'm not a huge fan of them anyway because there always seems to be small annoyances with them and I hate restoring from one.

 

We got an enterprise system from Oxilir costing roughly 5 grand but it was definitely worth it. That's who sold us the Retrospect.

 

The only other question I have is am I going to have to create one single disaster recovery CD or do I have to create one for each backup set?

[Lennart_T]

Quote:

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Anyone who relies on progressive or incremental backups or any software that only backs up changed files is taking a huge risk. I hope some of these posters here are nothing more than retrospect users. If they actually worked for retrospect that would be pretty pathetic. You really don't see anything risky about keeping one copy of a backup? Are you serious? Businesses go under every day for the sole reason of a failed network.

 

 

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Progressive backup is NOT the same as having only one backup copy!!!!!!

http://www.snwonline.com/storage_knowledge_center/speed_vs_accuracy_01-26-04.asp?article_id=351

 

We do a full backup to NEW MEDIA every weekend, progressive backups every night until the next weekend.

Once a month a complete set of tapes goes to the bank vault.

The other are stored in a data media fireproof "safe" for at least two months until they are erased and reused.

[willflint]

Brian,

You are very welcome, I had the same reservations about performing ONLY incrementals on my mission critical servers. But once I realized there was a way to do it with Retro I was extremely happy about the product. Believe me, like I said, I went through so many D2D2T products it was ridiculous. Especially when some of them made feature promises but the software couldn't come close to delivering (Yosemite and Acronis) or just were not right for my environment (Backup Exec and Brighstor). Essentially I needed something with all the right tools and attributes and luckilly I found a magazine review in Network Computing (Sept 2005) that compared all those products and Retrospect was the top scorer. I tried the others first and left Retro for last (with the exception of Brightstor since it just didn't work as a D2D solution, they really shouldn't call it D2D2T since it is not made to allow permanent disk storage or do point-in-time restores). Anyway, Acronis failed my test horribly. Then Yosemite turned out not to fit our requirements, required TOO MUCH hands-on maintenance (Yes, more than Retro) and could not perform a DR restore eventhough that was a selling point in its feature list. And Backup Exec had issues and wasn't a good fit for my environment. So then came Retro, man was I in for a treat! It could actually perform the DR restore as promised (and to answer your question, you need a DR CD for each Source Server/Client, more later). The backups are not rendered useless if you lose the database (the backupset catalog file can be recreated using the actual backup). The scripts allow for automating the backup, archive and restore of data. The proactive scheme, as shown in the article Lennart referenced, is an improvement over incremental backups and provides for Single Instance Storage of backup files. And most importantly, I was able to meet and exceed the data recovery requirements of my environment.

 

Anyway, enough Retro marketing, as for your question about the DR CD. Yes, you do need a CD for each source and if I'm not mistaken EMC recommends that a new CD is created each time there is a change on the server backedup, to allow the CD to make an accurate and fast recovery (believe me, most of these companies are being forced to provide "fast" solutions due to business needs not our technical needs). However, I have tested a restore using a 1 day old backup on a 5 day old DR CD and it worked just fine. I am pretty sure that if you make changes such as moving to a dual-proc or quad-proc or different video card on the server, then you should make a new DR CD. As far as I could tell, and I'm sure someone may be able to confirm, a DR CD is essentially a base install of your server/client's OS, drivers and current patches. All Retro has to do then is restore the files, registry and system state data. Anyway, I am glad I could help, let me know how it goes.