TheBum Posted June 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2004 Quote: did you use the uninstaller or just delete the client application? I tried it both ways, deleting just the client app the first time I reinstalled and then using the uninstaller the second time. Quote: were the /Library/Preferences/Retroclient.state file and the /Library/Starupitems/RetroClient folder deleted? Unknown. I can try an uninstall followed by a reinstall, paying attention to the disposition of those two files, and try testing it again. If the problem recurs, I'll also check permissions on the Retroclient.state file. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayoff Posted June 25, 2004 Report Share Posted June 25, 2004 Make sure your computer does not contain an "inactive" prior system created when doing a clean system install. I have seen Retroclient.state hide in old systems that the currently logged in user (even if they are Admin) can't access. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBum Posted June 25, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2004 A post over at MacInTouch (in the "Panther" report in response to my post) suggests that installing the client when logged in as root might solve the problem. I'll add that to my contingency plan. As for inactive former systems, I did do an archive-and-install when I installed Panther. The archived system is probably still there. I don't think I need it anymore (I've been running Panther since about a month after it came out and haven't even looked at the archived system since then), so I'll try deleting it. That might also explain the success with the aforementioned root install approach. Thanks to everybody for your suggestions! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted June 25, 2004 Report Share Posted June 25, 2004 Quote: installing the client when logged in as root might solve the problem When run according to the directions in the ReadMe, the Vise installer is fully capable of authenticating and installing the Retrospect OS X Client software with all the appropriate permissions. Logging into the Aqua Finder as root is not necessary. There _is_ an issue with the Vise installer when it is run from a mounted shared volume; in that case, the authentication fails on the first try, and additional attempts within the system's default authentication window will install the software parts but will not give them the correct permission settings (notably the all-important "setUID" bit). When the client is improperly installed, pitond will not run at all, and will put up an alert to the fact that it was installed without correct permissions. I've never attempted to run the Vise installer from a shared volume while logged into the Finder as root; perhaps it'll work, perhaps not. But in either way this is not the cause of the pitond hangs seen in this thread. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBum Posted July 2, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2004 I hope I'm not jinxing it by reporting this, but here goes... I determined that I had already deleted all of my previous systems, so that wasn't the problem. I tried the root install approach and that didn't work either. However, I noticed that the retroclient.state file gets installed with "-rw-r--r--" privileges (write privileges only for the root user) and an owner/group of root/admin. Suspecting a permissions problem, I tried changing the privileges to "-rw-rw-r--" (giving write privileges to the admin group) and I've been running for 4 straight days without the problem recurring. My normal account is an admin account, so I don't know what would happen if I was running a regular user account (hypothetical question: would I need to enable write privileges for everyone?). <pessimism> OK, now that I've said it, the problem will probably pop up again this weekend. </pessimism> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBum Posted July 3, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 3, 2004 Doh!! Wouldn't you know it, when I checked it after I got home, it was messed up again. I knew it was too good to be true. Well, I guess it's time to call Dantz support (or live with it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
religon Posted July 6, 2004 Report Share Posted July 6, 2004 Think I have been observing the same or a related problem. Server 10.3.3 with Retrospect 6.0178 (out-of-state server so have yet to upgrade). About 10 clients. 1 static IP, 9 DHCP. Subnet: 255.255.252.0. Worked great 3 or 4 months ago when setup. AIT 3 Sony 8 Tape Library jumping tapes w/o user intervention. Slowly, clients stopped getting backed up. Speculate that when IP lease expired backups stopped. (Note: Please, no requests to provide more info or additional troubleshooting. I am unable to comply due to work load and travel schedule.) Odd thing seen prior to forcing the server to re-lookup IP addresses: bouncing/disappearing Client list from Configure, Clients, Network. I saw this in version 4.x once, but I think it was a broader network problem. I wish I knew more about the network for this current problem. International corporation, heavily firewalled, proxy server for HTTP, no other outlets, DHCP, no AppleTalk through backbone, Cisco routers, the usual. By adding the IP the each client (Add by address button), they are able to participate in the backup. Not sure, but thought I would throw this out. Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pomme-homme Posted July 7, 2004 Report Share Posted July 7, 2004 Same problem here on client 6.0.108 on an iMac 700. My problem with the client shutting itself off began last week after updating the OS from 10.2.8 (where the same client worked OK) to 10.3.4 (where every morning after the machine is started, the client OFF radio button is selected.) If I don't remember to change it to ON, I get a -1028 error when running my daily backup script at 1630h. I can ping the iMac just fine, the client is in the appropriate place, I have uninstalled and reinstalled both the client and removed and replaced the client in Startup Items, all to no avail. On restart or shutdown/start, the OFF button is always selected. On Logout/Login sometimes the on button will stay selected if it was selected before logout. A conflict with 10.3.4? That is the only thing I changed. P-h Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oliver.kess Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Don't bother about the system version. It is not 10.3.4 causing the problem. Our Xserve still runs (stable) on 10.3 and has the above mentioned problems of turning off occasionally. I do not have the slightest clue what causes this, as other clients also running 10.3 or 10.3x do not turn off. I did all the stuff from uninstalling like dantz wants us to, to reinstall as root or entering root as the user when reinstalling. There was no file left from the client before reinstalling and it won't work as expected. Sometimes when I log off and back on the client starts and is on, sometimes it starts and keeps being off. Everything I can say is that Retrospect Client for OS X is not as reliable as the OS 9 version and I think it is a bad joke of Dantz Support to charge for a problem discussed that widely and to offer a refund if it is a bug. I am the customer who believes to buy a solid piece of software not the developer or a beta tester. Has not one of you solved this problem and would like to share his/her knowledge? If none, it seems like a bug to me or lack of documentation... regards Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted July 8, 2004 Report Share Posted July 8, 2004 Oliver, Reading up through this thread, have you observed the same things that were reported by Alan? Specifically the existance of multiple instances of pitond when you manually set the Client radio button to "on?" >Sometimes when I log off and back on the client starts and is on... pitond starts at a lower level then user log ons. Loggin out of the Finder and back in wouldn't effect a program that started at system start (pitond writes to the system log at startup). Can you describe this behavior more fully? >...sometimes it starts and keeps being off Can you explain what you mean by this? IMHO this is not an issue of permissions on the state file, nor is it related to how the Vise installer authenticates and installs (there's no need for root anything; if it's installed withouth correct permission it won't run at all, period). Alan's report is the most thorough (and others in this thread would do well to attempt to observe if their experiences are the same), and it points to a simple matter (ha!) of a unix process hanging. What's missing from this thread continues to be information regarding the status of the pitond process(es) when things go bad. Tools such as top or Activity Monitor should give helpful information. pitond should be pretty well baked by now. It was written even before Dantz shipped Retrospect 5.0, and is used for the Linux client as well as the OS X client. I can't believe that Dantz isn't interested in documented cases of it hanging or stalling on an XServe. If you have an open support incident, I'd suggest that this is the information that they need to escalate to their engineers. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oliver.kess Posted July 9, 2004 Report Share Posted July 9, 2004 Dave, thanks for your reply. I cannot tell you in which state pitond is, when it crashes. I did not have any log arguments on until today. Have you never had a machine with retrospect client at your site that stopped working like described before? >>...sometimes it starts and keeps being off >Can you explain what you mean by this? It is like I say. For an unknown reason it starts in the on state or it does not and keeps being off. I cannot help you (Are you from Dantz?) on refining the quest for the source of the problem. I don't want to pay Dantz Support for this issue as well. I feel that I should not have to. Yes, I have talked to Dantz Support on this issue and they stated I would have to. It seems as if I would have to wait until a lucky developer solves this issue on its own and I get an update. As pessimistic as I am, I expect the problem to be solved in version 7. And version 7 will be an upgrade I must pay for, right ;-) I am sure, someone will answer now, that version 7 is not yet in the pipeline and it is not sure, whether someone has to pay for that... regards and have a nice weekend! Oliver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted July 9, 2004 Report Share Posted July 9, 2004 > cannot tell you in which state pitond is, when it crashes. What "log arguments" have you enabled? Since you're noticing that the Retrospect Client program's radio button is "off," that would be the time to inspect the processes, either remotely via ssh and top, or at the machine using Activity Monitor. - What does the Status window of the Client application read when it's in this state? >Have you never had a machine with retrospect client at your site that stopped working like described before? Never. For an unknown reason it starts in the on state or it does not and keeps being off. Still unclear. - When the machine boots, the OS X Client software sometimes is on and sometimes is off? - When the machine boots and the client software is not on it remains not on? I could continue to parse your original description and this additional, slightly contridictory information and _try_ to hit on the events you've observed, but it's making my head hurt. A better way would be for you to list the specific observations you've made about this. >I cannot help you (Are you from Dantz?)... No. ...on refining the quest for the source of the problem. No one's asking you to engage in a quest for the source. Only to accurately and thoroughly report the problem as you've seen it. >I don't want to pay Dantz Support for this issue as well. I feel that I should not have to. ... It seems as if I would have to wait until a lucky developer solves this issue on its own and I get an update. I must admit that I remain baffled by this stance. You own an XServe, a high performance computer server. And you're stubbornly unwilling to invest $70 in making sure its data gets backed up reliably. And since it's entirely possible that this is _not_ a Retrospect bug, working with Tech Support would either help to solve your individual issue (in which case the expense would be reasonable), or to isolate the issue and help them to modify the code to keep it from happening to anyone else (in which case they'll most likely refund your initial investment and thank you for your help). Waiting for an engineer to stumble on this isn't very productive. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeevangelist Posted July 9, 2004 Report Share Posted July 9, 2004 > And since it's entirely possible that this is _not_ a Retrospect bug, I'd say it's very likely a Retrospect bug, or at the very least an interaction with other things on the system that only manifests itself in Retrospect. A QUESTION TO OTHERS HAVING THIS PROBLEM: Do you run any of these system enhancements - A Better Finder, iAddressX, Remote Desktop, Salling Clicker, or Synergy? I run these on the machine that has the problem most frequently and since they all load 'behind the scenes', I wondered one of them might be involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 Put me down for SallingCliker. Issue not seen. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBum Posted July 11, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2004 I don't run any of them, but I do run Chicken of the VNC on the laptop and OSXvnc on the server. I, of course, am having the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pomme-homme Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 None of these enhancements here. P-h Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
religon Posted July 15, 2004 Report Share Posted July 15, 2004 While I don't leave OSXvnc running, I do run it occasionally on servers exhibiting this problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgilpin Posted July 16, 2004 Report Share Posted July 16, 2004 I have this problem on two Macs (eMac and G4), but not on another eMac (all on 100baseT). The two that have the problem had been upgraded from 10.2 to 10.3, but the working one came with 10.3 installed. Maybe that is a clue to someone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgilpin Posted July 27, 2004 Report Share Posted July 27, 2004 When a client stops responding, it has a status of "Not Running" in the Retrospect Client app. Also pitond is not listed in Activity Monitor until after the On button is selected, and the Status is then "Ready". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted July 27, 2004 Report Share Posted July 27, 2004 dgilpin, When you observe that you "have this problem" are you experiencing exactly the same thing(s) that Alan reported? He observed multiple instances of pitond, with unique PID numbers; have you seen this too? If the pitond unix process is not running it will not show in Activity Monito, the Retrospect Client application will display "Not Running" and the radio button will be off. And those values will change to what you've listed when you turn it on. All that is expected behavior. Can you provide information regarding when the status goes from Ready to Not Running? For example, will it remain Ready across a single system restart? Go ahead, try it; we'll wait... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgilpin Posted August 2, 2004 Report Share Posted August 2, 2004 Sorry for the delay! I do not see any instance of pitond in activity monitor until I go to the client and turn it on. Then one instance shows up and it works fine. Now I had been convinced it was sleep mode getting in the way, but I just tried turning the client back on and then did a restart. After logging in the client was back off! I suppose it could be a restart instead of sleep. That would explain the varying number of days that it would take for the client to turn off. By the way, one of the macs is also has the fax running, and it needs to be turned off and back on (control panel) every morning in order for it to work (it will not answer otherwise). I was thinking the two were related, but maybe not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted August 2, 2004 Report Share Posted August 2, 2004 Quote: I just tried turning the client back on and then did a restart. After logging in the client was back off! You moved Retrospect Client from its default install location of /Applications/, didn't you...? There have been numerous threads here on the Forum about this. Either move the client back where it was installed, or edit the script in /Library/StartupItems/RetroClient/ to reflect whatever prefered location you want. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgilpin Posted August 3, 2004 Report Share Posted August 3, 2004 No, the client is right where it was installed. It is in the /Applications/Retrospect Client directory. But there is no /Library/StartupItems/RetroClient directory or script. I will go have a look at the one that is working after restarts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeDave Posted August 3, 2004 Report Share Posted August 3, 2004 The 5.x client lived in "/Applications/Retrospct Client/" while the 6.x client lives alone in "/Applications/". If in doubt, re-run the installer. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgilpin Posted August 3, 2004 Report Share Posted August 3, 2004 Well, I have /Applications/Retrospect 5.0, /Applications/Retrospect 5.1, and /Applications/Retrospect Client directories, with the latter holding the 6.0 client app. I have not moved any of these. I think the installer is messing up with upgrading. New installs must work, as that is the only Mac that the client works on. EDIT: I went ahead and did the uninstall/reinstall, and the client is now by itself in Applications, and the script is there. I expect it will be fine now. I just don't know why it would have installed it the way it was in the first place. Thanks for your help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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