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I'm attempting to set up a new install of Retrospect 8 and I can't seem to get to any of the folders on the client machine(s). I've uninstalled and re-installed the client. I've restarted the Retrospect engine. The client(s) are currently set up using a keypair and add clients automatically is turned on in the Preferences. I've deleted the client and re-added it using both Multicasting and directly via IP address. All to no avail. I've followed the instructions in the manual to a "t" - I think. Very disconcerting for someone who's been using Retrospect since the Dantz days (v. 4/5). For what it's worth we are (maybe) moving up from Retro 6. I ran the new client installer without disabling or deleting the previous client, but have since deleted the Client.app and reinstalled it again. Surely this is a result of ignorance - what use would a client be if I can't specify what I want to back up from that client. I've included two screenshots - one of the source screen as I added the client, the second of the Sources pane as it appears once the client has been added. I was under the assumption that at this point I could browse the Client and/or add Favorites of folders, volumes, etc. Any help is appreciated.

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Please check the volume names. We found a bug this week that can cause this if the name of the disk is super small. Like 1 or 2 characters.

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Volume names are at least 5 characters and of the two I'm testing, one is just Macintosh HD. I did go ahead and set up a script for one client to see if I could get anything to back up at all and the log shows "Container David's Mac was empty (had no volumes)."

 

One machine is running Leopard, the other Snow Leopard (David's Mac). I've also reinstalled both clients from scratch after what I think is a complete uninstall (per these instructions). The Leopard Mac is using a public key, the Snow Leopard Mac is using a custom password. I haven't managed to discover the culprit - but it appears that for some reason the Client's volumes are no showing up. Incidentally, firewall is turned off, file sharing is on sharing one folder on each Mac.

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In the second screenshot, click Options. You should see Back up: and a dropdown, below which should be a list of volumes on the selected client. Make sure something is selected.

 

That done, you should see a little triangle to the left of the client name. Expand that, then you should be able to browse a volume. You can't browse a client.

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In the second screenshot, click Options. You should see Back up: and a dropdown, below which should be a list of volumes on the selected client. Make sure something is selected.

 

That done, you should see a little triangle to the left of the client name. Expand that, then you should be able to browse a volume. You can't browse a client.

I wish it were that easy. I think we've established that the problem is Volumes on the Clients are not visible for some reason. Regardless of the option (All, Selected or Startup), no Volumes will show up.

Edited by dburney

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Guest Steve Maser

Are the clients at their login screens?

 

This sounds like the bug where clients can't be browsed if they login/logout twice and they leave the computer at the login screen.

 

If so, either reboot the computers or log them in. That will fix the issue (until it happens again when the user logs in/logs out twice.

 

I have hopes that the new client will fix this bug.

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Are the clients at their login screens?

 

This sounds like the bug where clients can't be browsed if they login/logout twice and they leave the computer at the login screen.

 

If so, either reboot the computers or log them in. That will fix the issue (until it happens again when the user logs in/logs out twice.

 

I have hopes that the new client will fix this bug.

 

Unfortunately the users are indeed logged in and the machines are awake, not even running a screen saver. I've tried turning the client app off/on and immediately rebooting as well. I could see something hokey happening with one client. But two leads me to believe that I'm missing something, but I don't know what it could be. Both machines are running the latest version of the client, are wired (not wireless), able to share files/folders with other machine, even show up in Retrospect 6. I've added one machine manually with a static IP, the other using "Automatically Add Clients" - nothing works.

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Guest Steve Maser

I've only seen this in Snow Leopard when the clients have logged in/logged out twice and are sitting at the login screen (which I believe is not a Leopard bug...)

 

So, some things to check:

 

1) You said you added one machine manually with a static IP. If you remove and readd that client (is it the SL client? And is it logged in?) do the volumes reappear?

 

If so, are you sure that client is retaining the static IP address when it reboots? Some people run "static DHCP" on clients, some people have clients configured with manually entered IP addresses, some people have *dynamic* DHCP only -- in the latter case, clients *could* get different IP addresses based on DHCP server lease time, etc...

 

 

2) If you open Network Utility on the engine computer and do a "port scan" of the client machine(s), are you seeing port 497 open:

 

 

Open TCP Port: 497 dantz

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I've only seen this in Snow Leopard when the clients have logged in/logged out twice and are sitting at the login screen (which I believe is not a Leopard bug...)

 

So, some things to check:

 

1) You said you added one machine manually with a static IP. If you remove and readd that client (is it the SL client? And is it logged in?) do the volumes reappear?

 

If so, are you sure that client is retaining the static IP address when it reboots? Some people run "static DHCP" on clients, some people have clients configured with manually entered IP addresses, some people have *dynamic* DHCP only -- in the latter case, clients *could* get different IP addresses based on DHCP server lease time, etc...

 

 

2) If you open Network Utility on the engine computer and do a "port scan" of the client machine(s), are you seeing port 497 open:

 

 

Open TCP Port: 497 dantz

 

1. Removing and re-adding clients doesn't appear to make a difference and the user is always logged in. The SL client has a static IP manually entered.

 

2. I've ran the port scan on both clients (static IP added and auto-added with public key) and they both have the appropriate port open and neither have the firewall running.

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Guest Steve Maser

Are the volumes using FileVault?

 

What do you show in Terminal on the clients if you list /Volumes like this:

 

Lion:log admin$ ls -la /Volumes

total 24

drwxrwxrwt@ 4 root admin 136 Jun 17 17:50 .

drwxr-xr-x 32 root wheel 1156 Jun 17 17:52 ..

-rw-r--r--@ 1 admin admin 6148 Jun 11 13:57 .DS_Store

lrwxr-xr-x 1 root admin 1 Jun 17 17:50 Macintosh HD -> /

Lion:log admin$

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I've had this condition for ages. Tried some basic troubleshooting earlier but couldn't get it to work. Thankfully client access is not my primary use of Retrospect, so I gave up trying and decided to wait for the new client. I know, not up to my usual level of investigation.

 

It's on all three of the machines on my (small) LAN that have the client installed, which points to the Engine. Removing/Adding client Source has no effect. New Engine preference file has no effect. Adding via keypair or password is the same.

I can refresh successfully. I can change password successfully. I can apply the (6.3.029) Client Updater.

All machines 10.6.x. No machines are at login screen (ie all have users logged in).

 

** I do notice that my clients look the same in the Sources list (same as dburny pix above) even when a client is no longer on the network (no offline icon); is that how is is supposed to work? **

 

*** Doh, another datapoint; Engine host is Snow Leopard Server. ***

 

Robin, I could have sworn you mentioned the short volume name issue months ago; did something new get found recently?

 

 

 

I guess I should install the Engine on my new iMac; as slow as this Apple branded SSD is it sure boots up fast!

Edited by CallMeDave

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Are the volumes using FileVault?

 

What do you show in Terminal on the clients if you list /Volumes like this:

 

Lion:log admin$ ls -la /Volumes

total 24

drwxrwxrwt@ 4 root admin 136 Jun 17 17:50 .

drwxr-xr-x 32 root wheel 1156 Jun 17 17:52 ..

-rw-r--r--@ 1 admin admin 6148 Jun 11 13:57 .DS_Store

lrwxr-xr-x 1 root admin 1 Jun 17 17:50 Macintosh HD -> /

Lion:log admin$

 

Here's what I get…

 

 

Davids-Mac:~ dburney$ ls -la /Volumes

total 16

drwxrwxrwt@ 6 root admin 204 Jun 20 08:20 .

drwxrwxr-t@ 40 root admin 1428 Jun 20 08:21 ..

-rw-r--r-- 1 dburney admin 82 Apr 26 08:28 ._iTunesFS

drwxrwxr-t@ 41 root admin 1462 Jun 15 17:50 MacClone

lrwxr-xr-x 1 root admin 1 Jun 20 08:20 Nacho -> /

drwxr-xr-x@ 47 dburney staff 1666 May 19 16:58 Pustulio

 

 

Does not look out of the ordinary. Nacho is the volume that want. None of our machines are using FileVault. On a side note, I assume that this version of the client won't work with Retrospect 6? I need to move back to 6 until this is resolved and am guessing I'll need to uninstall V. 6.3 and reinstall 6.2.

Edited by dburney

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Guest Steve Maser

So, out of curiosity -- what if you rename "Nacho" to the standard "Macintosh HD" (and reboot). Any difference if you remove/readd the client at that point?

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Guest Steve Maser

I have seen new clients I add -- when the client was already configured -- have a "clear" status button, but I've always been able to browse them.

 

Clients with xcode installed, clients with a BootCamp partition, clients with both a SL and a Leopard partition -- apart from the "volume with a really small name" issue that I remember testing when somebody pointed it out, I've never been unable to browse an on-line client -- except for the SL two login/logout/stay at the login screen issue.

 

 

My *guess* is it's related to whatever causes *that* problem, but short of being able to reproduce that specific problem, it's never been clear what the underlying cause of the problem has been.

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I have seen new clients I add -- when the client was already configured -- have a "clear" status button, but I've always been able to browse them.

 

If you take a client that's in the Sources list offline, does its status change in the list? The way a local or network volume will get the little lightning bolt icon in the status column?

 

And is the original poster hosting the engine on a Desktop or a Server version of OS X?

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So, out of curiosity -- what if you rename "Nacho" to the standard "Macintosh HD" (and reboot). Any difference if you remove/readd the client at that point?

No change after renaming the volume.

 

If you take a client that's in the Sources list offline, does its status change in the list? The way a local or network volume will get the little lightning bolt icon in the status column?

 

 

And is the original poster hosting the engine on a Desktop or a Server version of OS X?

The icon in the status column (far left of client name in the Sources view) has always been gray (clear) - I've never seen any of the other status colors as indicated in the manual.

 

Running the Desktop version of OS X. This machine is also running Studiometry which we use for job tickets, project coordination and billing. Studiometry and Retrospect are all this machine does. It is the last G5 model prior to the Intel boxes - 8 GB RAM.

 

Is the issue at this forum post related to this current one?

I believe that topic is regarding Firewall settings. All of our clients have their Firewall turned off.

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Guest Steve Maser

You are running the engine on a G5?

 

Do you have an intel machine you can install the engine on, add the same clients and see if you get the same problem? (It's trivial to remove it after testing this...)

 

 

Maybe this is a PPC issue?

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** I do notice that my clients look the same in the Sources list (same as dburny pix above) even when a client is no longer on the network (no offline icon); is that how is is supposed to work? **

Yes, the icon to the left of the client will show only clear (meaning it was never backed up) or green arrow (backed up at least once).

 

There should, however, be a disclosure triangle to the left of the client name as soon as the client is added, even if no other action has been taken. This is what's missing in dburney's screenshot.

 

An offline icon will appear next to a client volume if Retrospect attempted to access the volume during a backup or browse operation and the volume was offline at the time.

 

Steve Maser: When you attempt to access a client after the double logout, do the client volumes then display the offline icon? If you remove a client, perform the double logout, and then attempt to re-add the client, does it get listed without the disclosure triangle?

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Maybe this is a PPC issue?

No; my Engine host is Core2 Duo; all clients are x86.

 

 

The icon in the status column (far left of client name in the Sources view) has always been gray (clear) - I've never seen any of the other status colors as indicated in the manual.

My fault, I was directing this at the users who do _not_ see this problem. Twickland says a working client in the Sources list will not reflect offline status in real-time, as it does with local and network file sharing volumes. I was just searching for other ways my system's behavior might be different from a properly working install.

 

 

There should, however, be a disclosure triangle to the left of the client name as soon as the client is added, even if no other action has been taken. This is what's missing in dburney's screenshot

Yep; that's the crux of the issue, for me as well as dburney.

 

 

If you remove a client, perform the double logout, and then attempt to re-add the client, does it get listed without the disclosure triangle?

I just installed the client on a freshly re-booted machine (boots directly to user account; no login screen). Same issue.

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You are running the engine on a G5?

 

Do you have an intel machine you can install the engine on, add the same clients and see if you get the same problem? (It's trivial to remove it after testing this...)

 

 

Maybe this is a PPC issue?

 

Since CallMeDave is having a similar issue, I don't think this is isolated to PPC. Though if I get a chance this week I'll see what I can do. Ultimately though the G5 with SCSI card and the tape drive is our archive box, the worker bees get the Intels - so getting the engine to run on x86 and see the clients won't help much :(

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Guest Steve Maser

Steve Maser: When you attempt to access a client after the double logout, do the client volumes then display the offline icon? If you remove a client, perform the double logout, and then attempt to re-add the client, does it get listed without the disclosure triangle?

 

 

When a SL client is in a double-logout state, there will be no volumes visible (like the OP's problem). It's not an "off-line icon" problem -- there are just *no* volumes visible.

 

I can't test this right now to say what happens when you remove/readd a client in this state -- I can try that tomorrow and let you know.

 

But the Retrospect engineers *do* know about the double-logout SL client problem (as it's 100% reproducible) -- and that's why I'm hoping the new rewritten client won't have the same issue.

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When a SL client is in a double-logout state, there will be no volumes visible (like the OP's problem). It's not an "off-line icon" problem -- there are just *no* volumes visible.

 

I can't test this right now to say what happens when you remove/readd a client in this state -- I can try that tomorrow and let you know.

 

But the Retrospect engineers *do* know about the double-logout SL client problem (as it's 100% reproducible) -- and that's why I'm hoping the new rewritten client won't have the same issue.

 

Not sure I understand the issue completely, but making a catalog copy is ALWAYS a good idea to allow at least some recovery of files from an existing catalog if the inexplicable (or even the possible) happens again. So there are some saves to be with a little bit of planning. I make a catalog backup weekly onto a different drive than the backup files and different than the client drive.

 

Guess I'm lucky enough to have a variety of options in this regard. Of course my backup needs are small compared to some of you. But storage 'iron' is relatively cheap and my Mini which serves to manage all that iron does a fine job.

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I can confirm that on occasion I have tried to drill into a client's attached storage (mounted volumes etc) and found that my Retro 8 Admin console thinks that the client's drives are "offline" (~ symbol). This happens when nobody is logged into the console of the client workstation. As soon as any user logs into the console of the client, then Retro suddenly "sees" the drives on the client. At this point I can add sub folders as Favorites, etc.

 

This behavior is not acceptable, as many of my client Macs are actually production servers (Xserves etc), and thus nobody ever logs into the clients via the console.

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