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baweeks

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About baweeks

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  1. baweeks

    Retrospect Insights And 2011 Roadmap

    To Eric Ullman: No mention whether "retrospect solo" will have a mac version. Will there be? Planned to be concurrent with Windows version or later? Would be very helpful to me. I work in mental health and need backups to hard disks that are encrypted, with the capability to do one disk one week onsite with the other disk offsite, and the next week vice versa via sneakernet, able to do bare metal recovery. Retrospect is the only one out there for the Mac that I know of. Time Machine is light years from this, being totally insecure. (Some other competitors can encrypt the data, but not the filename, which might be a patient name, unhelpful here.) The large increase in speed for v.8 was welcome, but at the end of the day when I want to go home, I want to go home, not wait 15 minutes to scan my disk, then a few minutes to compare changes, etc. etc. An immediate knowledge by Retro of what needs backing up (even at the file level would be fine for me) would be a very large bonus. (On the mac, would that use System Events introduced in 10.5?) Other requests are Retro needs a large improvement in the stability of the config.dat/bat files, run documents, and grooming times. I'm fine with keeping things as far as one backup hard disk will fill and keep grooming to to keep it onto one 1TB backup USB drive, but Retrospect took 11 hours to groom when the disk was nearly full using a disk media set. That's just untenable for me. Also, I use 7.7 to back up the Windows machine that I have to use. I think I understand it uses a similar underlying engine, but 7.7 is a whole lot faster than 8 on the mac in terms of write speed without compression. Will 8.x be speeded up on the roadmap? -baweeks
  2. I agree that there may be less justification for a File Media Set. I just wanted to try one backup drive with one type of media set, and another drive with another type of media set, to see what it was like. One potential reason for using a File Media Set would be that I want to limit my use of media sets to 1TB each, to fit in 1TB, so I just don't keep adding and adding disks onto the media set. A File Media Set would start grooming when the 1TB disk was getting full. Am "repairing" the catalog now. Will see what happens and report back.
  3. I've been using two 1TB USB drives to backup my MacBook Pro 4,1 laptop. REtro v.399. Drives direct-connected. Drive A stays at home a week, Drive B gets used once or twice a week at work, then sneakernet reverses this with Drive A at work, B at home. Just to learn how things work, Disk B is a File Media Set (Disk A is a Disk Media Set). I had to restore my /~/Library/Mail folder from my Disk B's File Media Set. Now, this media set said after verification that execution was successful, although the issue of the log saying that there were a few files yet to verify appeared most every backup. In short, no warning from Retrospect while backing up that there might be problems restoring. I had the restore assistant restore the /~/Library/Mail folder to a folder named Mail restore target ƒ which was sitting on my desktop. But what odd errors! See below. What seems odd to me is that the File Media Set seems to restore every backup session as an append to the same, single, large file. It does not appear to be a package file. So why so many file headers are bad if it's only one file? I have only performed a half dozen backup sessions to this File Media Set, yet the error log below shows a great multiple more header errors than there are backup sessions. I tried it once again, and the same set of errors. Now, on just doing a look-through of the various folders within the Mail folder, everything seems to look fine, but that doesn't mean that every file might be just a bunch of hash. I could try running Mail with this folder, but I worry that if there is corruption it the backup, it might send corrupted data to my IMAP server. Any word if these are malignant or benign error warnings.? Thank you. Drive Executing Restore Assistant - 2011/04/10 5:42 PM at 2011/04/10 To volume Mail restore target ƒ... - 2011/04/10 5:56:32 PM: Restoring from B-FM Set, Snapshot /Volumes/Sammy, 2011/03/27 7:43:34 PM > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at df39edd8) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 25744332) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 46c8ac14) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 6be89255) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 49f51d2c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at c3c0305c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 37433baa) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at c7960d81) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 9059e393) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 415025da) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 2b483932) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b90888d9) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 9407a235) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b6382b1) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 4e15ca5c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f899e80) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 89ae91b8) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at e5206d41) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at e102c175) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at a09d0144) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 70bc2b0b) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at bb97f62) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at ba6a9e77) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b85950a8) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 4b7d6f4c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 52cff64d) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at ab50f8ae) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 4155147c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 44a87d37) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at be7f7ab3) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 634c1f38) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 550e8516) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f3513154) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 248455f1) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 8c798e33) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 94cbb7d8) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at be7f7ab3) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b9bb9588) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 6412f865) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 7742241e) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at e282d35a) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 79fb919d) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 27df44d0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 3d59c9d4) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 7f488023) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at d2691cdc) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 94c7216f) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 8f84bbc0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 79fb919d) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 6fcb4603) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 16dfdc68) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 67852a77) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 67bf5cea) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f239cebd) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 8f84bbc0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 66912ba0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 3069cda5) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 16dfdc68) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 90dab657) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at e5206d41) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 5108da4d) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 133ed427) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 6b047c26) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at fc2e6724) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at fee89304) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 5e07a628) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f3513154) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at a69b89f1) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 89661453) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 3661f49a) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 6081bdd0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f612006) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 568b3abf) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at d35cff9d) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at d348ba55) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b47bd31e) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 81004f85) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at ad3ba588) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 44a87d37) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 2d3cfcd0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 9ed2c0aa) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 833843db) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b2044d30) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 962c5544) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at c9eabf47) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 7e7dcaff) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f9560172) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b14f84b4) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at eaa62514) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at a69e1ea6) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 673c3bdd) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 980b1cf5) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 932e02dc) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at e4430aa0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 8d4c4a3c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 7f20d311) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at e943026b) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 507fbac7) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f7817cd7) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f4c9b9b4) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 833843db) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 7f79d6c0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at efa9a740) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at e6bcbdfe) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 74429792) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 3dd1ed9a) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 86e4bad6) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at a27de8fb) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 11e74940) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 46c8ac14) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 6b047c26) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 979075a6) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 7f0aa3a2) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at fee89304) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 3acf55e8) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 427f10e4) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 706e552c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at a4ae0546) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 21801fb4) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 14ccb6a6) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f68480e) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 2d7a69ca) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 67bf5cea) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 37582585) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 20ace0a0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 77208c97) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 1b178164) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 2c059d5a) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 67956f97) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 8c4f7f66) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b6f03ce4) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at b75628e4) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 54d61795) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 77208c97) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at d4949485) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 43c62bb7) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 4525c8d7) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 38088a91) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 7e7dcaff) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at f14e49dd) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 20ace0a0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at ebef026a) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 70bc2b0b) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 301f67be) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 9dd47b04) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at d2a2e9cc) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 67852a77) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at dd823eac) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at a5e7f59d) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 8decc539) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 85027f60) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at c8f094cc) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at d59ac64c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 6b42b6ae) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 11d12ed0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 573bacd6) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at fe2bd928) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 8d4c4a3c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at d35cff9d) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 706e552c) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at c00763f9) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at 7f79d6c0) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at be897e7d) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at ec40ce4f) > !Bad Media Set header found (0xx at a4bae233) 2011/04/10 6:06:31 PM: 165 execution errors Remaining: 165 files, 5.5 MB Completed: 77986 files, 4.7 GB Performance: 522.5 MB/minute Duration: 00:09:58 (00:00:49 idle/loading/preparing)
  4. Dear Smaser: -the "USB drive" is a single external pocket 1TB drive connected by USB 2, formatted Mac OS Extended (Journaled). The only thing that's NTFS is my VMWare Fusion machine, which is closed, Fusion not running. -There have been previous threads about the AAd.rdb error, with no seeming solution to them. -Thanks for your response. Hope this helps. -baweeks
  5. Two wierd errors. One about an error report about NTFS file system, the other about an AAd.rdb error discussed in earlier threads. I have two media sets, A on one disk and B on another disk, rotating offsite. Single-user configuration on a MacBookPro 4,1, Retro 8.2, 1.6.4. Media set A had been fine until the errors that seemed to be about corruption appeared, below. Note how even the log seems corrupt; horrible spelling. Bad spelling did not exist at the beginning of the log months ago. Here's the first error about what seems to be corruption. The computer was on the whole time, did not go to sleep during the activity (I checked the system log), and the USB drive was solidly connected. Retrospect version 8.2.0.399 Launched au 8/24/10 7:46:56 au + ExEcuting A-Verify MA-n Script at 8/24/10 - 8/24/10 7:50:11 AM: Verifying A-Big MA-n MS > !Trouble reading: "1-A-Big MA-n MS" (10714880), error -102 ( trouble communicating) > !Generated MD5 digest for file "/Volumes/Baril/Users/briarweeks/Documents/Personar Video.iMovieProject/MediarClip 03.dv" does not match stored MD5 digest. TFile::Read: read fadled, /Volumes/adBig-Madn/Retrospect/adBig Madn MS/1-adBig Madn MS/ad000099.rdb, oserr 6, error -1102 > !Trouble reading: "1-A-Big MA-n MS" (15304192), error -116 ( volume doesn't exist) 8/24/10 9:00:22 AM: 3 execution errors Remaining: 1904730 files, 207.8 GB Completed: 696337 files, 57 GB Performance: 1,766.6 MB/minute Duration: 01:10:11 (00:37:08 idle/loating/prepating) Total duralion: 01:10:11 (00:37:08 idle/loaling/prepaling) Here’s a weird error. An error about NTFS file system. No volumes formatted in NTFS on my configuration. + Retrospect version 8.2.0.399 Launched au 10/2/10 8:07:08 au + Normal balkup using A-MA-n Script at 10/2/10 To Media Set A-Big MA-n MS... - 10/2/10 4:44:55 PM: Copying Dylan AdditionAd error informAdion for Disk MediAdSet member "1-AdBig MAdn MS", CAd't write to file /Volumes/AdBig-MAdn/Retrospect/AdBig MAdn MS/1-AdBig MAdn MS/Add.rdb, error -1124 ( invAdid NTFS dAdAd > !Trouble writing: "1-A-Big MA-n MS" (1080430592), error -102 ( trouble communicating) - 10/2/10 10:06:26 PM: Verifying Dylan 10/2/10 10:43:11 PM: ExEcution stoppEd by opErator Remaining: 267627 files, 33.5 GB Completed: 128483 files, 12.2 GB Performance: 40.4 MB/minute Duration: 05:58:14 (00:49:58 idle/loating/prepating) Here's a report of just plain corruption. + Retrospect version 8.2.0.399 Launched au 11/14/10 9:07:42 au + Normal balkup using A-MA-n Script at 11/14/10 To Media Set A-Big MA-n MS... - 11/14/10 9:08:18 AM: Copying DylAM !The Media Set member "2-A-Big MA-n MS" is corrupt or has dasasfrom asother set. 11/14/10 2:15:50 PM: ExEcution stoppEd by opErator Remaining: 7220 files, 3.1 GB Completed: 0 files, 0 B Performance: 0 MB/minute Duration: 05:07:29 (05:07:19 idle/loating/prepating) Here's the AAd.rdb error. I’d had enough errors that seemed to be about corruption that I tried a catalog rebuild, and got the AAd.rdb error during the rebuild. + Retrospect version 8.2.0.399 Launched au 11/15/10 4:22:40 PM + ExEcuting Rebuild at 11/15/10 To Media Set A-Big MA-n MS... > The Disk Media Set da a file "AAd.rdb" reported missing by user After AfCAfAfog rebuild, only the most recent bAfkups for eAfh source Afe stored in the CAfAfog. Older backups cac be acded by going to the MediacSets' view Backups tac acd clicking Retrieve. 11/16/10 3:14:35 AM: 1 execution errors Completed: 3390824 files, 320.7 GB Performance: 904 MB/minute Duration: 06:06:11 (00:02:53 idle/loating/prepating) Exit at 11/16/10 6:59:13 PM I've since given up on the A media set and recycled it. Before I recycled it, I noticed that I had over-written a Word document and needed to retrieve the document from a date before it had been over-written, and Retro 8 rapidly found all previous versions of the file, and correctly recovered the one I wanted. Then I recycled the media set. Why the AAd.rdb error, I don't know. Why the NTFS error report, I don't know. I do know that any file on any application, on any machine, on any platform can become corrupt, Retrospect no exception. Any ideas if this error were to corruption of the backup data files, or due to .dat or .bak file corruption? BTW, I wish that the log would screen-wrap long lines of error reports, even with my monitor being 1440 pixels wide. Pain to side-scroll. Ideas? -baweeks
  6. This issue was the last straw that caused me, on a trial basis, to temporarily try Time Machine, I had an issue with grooming a media set on a 1TB USB disk. As the disk got full (and I had set the media set to use 100% of the disk), Retrospect started grooming the media set according to Retrospect's policy. It took *almost 8 hours* to decide what to groom, and then groomed only a tiny amount of the files. Is this correct behavior to take so long grooming? In the way I manage my days at work and the hours I sleep, this is untenable. The nine-hour groom, was on a media set B which had no corruption reports (I have media set A on one disk, media set B on another disk, rotating offsite, with corruption reports on media set A which I'll post later). ExEcuting B-Groom Main Script at 10/16/10 Grooming Media Set B-Big Main MS... Groomed 410 KB from Media Set B-Big Main MS. 10/16/10 10:37:07 PM: ExEcution complEtEd succEssfully Duration: 07:50:36 (00:00:02 idle/loating/prepating) All those hours to groom so few files? BTW, what a pain when inspecting the log file. Searching for a term in the search box, finding the term, then clearing the search box only serves to bring the log back to the beginning. You have to remember the date of the word you searched for, and then manually scroll down to the date where the search term was found. Yuk. Retro 8.2. MacBook Pro 4,1. 10.6.5. Single-user setup to USB 1TB drive. -baweeks
  7. baweeks

    Retro Config File(s) trashed

    How about creating an Automator script that would, while the engine is just idle and not processing a backup, do a copy of the .dat and .bak files to another location. It probably would be better to back up the .bak and .dat files if th engine were totally shut down (as using a restored .dat file which was backed up while running, might cause problems as the newly-backed-up file might think it was doing x but the operator would think the .dat file were doing y. Also, I'd worry that a >sudo killall (retro engine)< script would potentially mangle the .dat and .bak files. Is there a way to safely shut down the engine with applescript? Then one could use the second line in the script to copy over the .dat and .bak files to another location. That would more safely back them up. Does anyone know how to safely shut down the engine with a shell script that could be put into an applescript? Too bad that the Retrospect team still has not implemented the feature of running a script after an activity. I hope that making .dat and .bak more robust and un-mangle-able is high on the Retrospect team's list, as the constant mention on these forums of these files being fragile renders one less confident of Retrospect in general. -baweeks
  8. A few months ago Robin replied to another thread, just about this issue, that this is a "cosmetic bug" and it shouldn't be worried about, and he said that one could be confident that verification was OK. I would be more confident if Retrospect put up a KB saying that such files were DEFINITELY verfied, and that the bug is only in the *reporting8 of same. I agree that Retrospect reporting a large x number of files as not being verified using media verification is a confidence-reducing issue. If it truly is not verifying files starting with /, then they should post a KB about this, offer a workaround other than the time-consuming full verification, or find a way to fix the issue of backing up and/or reporting of / files. -baweeks -baweeks
  9. -I meant to ask one more thing, Robin. With every MD5 verification, Retrospect always says "execution successful," but gives a warning triangle, and looking at the log it says that about 5% or so of the files that were to be verified never got verified, they are "remaining." Is this a bug to be fixed, that it does not verify all the files that need verification? Would those un-verified files get verified the next time that backup script is run? -Finally, is there any way in 8.1 to see exactly what files got backed up in one certain (to use a deprecated 6.1 term), "session." I ask this because, if one does an archive-and-reinstall of the OS, would Retrospect ignore those new OS files, since they all have the same size, creation date, etc? Or is there some way that Retro sees the re-written OS files as fit to be backed up again? I'm curious how this scenario would work out. -baweeks
  10. Dear Robin: -Thanks for your reply. -I can turn off MD5 verification. I would imagine it would speed up the write phase of the backup a small amount, from the ~500 MB/min it is now. IIUC, that speed increase would be because there would no longer be the processor overhead of creating the MD5 key concurrently as it's writing the backup file. I've never had problems with the write phase. (Although, is the ~500GB/min I'm getting, about what's expected for backing up to a direct-connect USB2 drive with SimpleCrypt and software compression on? That's about double of what 6.1 got, BTW). -Your response makes me wonder if I was unclear. The sudden slowdown in speed is not in the write phase, it's in the verification phase. The verification phase is somewhere around 90% slower.Used to be ~2GB/min. I could turn MD5 verification off, but would that not just kill verification entirely, leaving me with a write phase only? What I'm looking for is for the verification phase to speed back up to where it once was. -Willing to try anything you suggest that can help. -Probably too late for the soon upcoming release, but I'd have a few interface suggestions. How to communicate them? -baweeks
  11. -All of a sudden, MD5 verification of backups has slowed from 2+ GB/min to ~300 MB/min. No idea why. It was not the transition to 10.6.3; I have had (usual) fast verifications after update to 10.6.3. -MacBook Pro 4,1, 4GB RAM, engine and console on same 1-person Mac, direct-connect backup to a USB2 drive, Retro 8.1.626 with the driver update that came out a month or so ago, OS 10.6.3, SimpleCrypt, software data compression. Write speeds remain the same, ~500MB/min (is that about right, considering my configuration?). I tested trying a backup of just my docs folder onto a new Media Set, and it still has slow MD5 backups. Speed of verification varies now from 300MB/min to ~1GB/min; far slower than formerly usual ~2GB/min. -Have run utilities to clean caches, have done the Combo 10.6.3 updater, run Disk Warrior, permissions, stopped and restarted the Engine, all to no avail. -Ideas? Completely remove and reinstall Retrospect? Could it be a config file corruption? I could compress and save my config files, and try freshly-created config files (ouch if I have to rebuild all scripts, etc). I do have stored and saved config files from months ago I could restore and try using. Other ideas for suddenly slow verification?
  12. baweeks

    backup to USB stick or iDisk

    -Why not try this. -Turn iDisk synching ON, but set the synchronization to "manually." -That way, Retrospect will write its file to the iDisk mirror file (~/Library/FileSync/yaddayadda) which is on your hard disk, but there will be no confusion regarding what to upload as it will not be uploading so long as you "manually" manage the synching between the mirror file on your HD and the cloud. -Then, once Retro is done writing to the mirror file, hit the little circle icon next to your iDisk in the Finder sidebar to sync the mirror file to the cloud. That way, there will be no issues regarding the OS trying to sync a file that is being written to the same time as the OS is trying to sync it. Essentially, what you might be doing is trying to sync a moving target (mixed metaphor). Or, if you don't have iDisk synching on, the OS might be having trouble uploading a file that is being written to far faster than your upload speed. -There were many posts when Dropbox came out about iDisk not being able to handle open files, and IIRC, Apple has a KB about iDisk not being able to handle open files. But if you try my suggestion, then you are not synching an open file to the cloud. -baweeks
  13. baweeks

    Retrospect 8 restore will not boot

    Dear SMaser: -You've got it almost. APM will boot an Intel Mac, but there are limitations like unable to rename the boot drive, and others I have forgotten. The installer DVD from Apple (at least in the late Tiger days when Intel Macs came to being) were actually APM, to install the Intel binary of 10.4.laterversions. -I don't know if the more-newly-released Intel Macs can still boot from APM, but at least the original Intel Macs could. -baweeks
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